This stands alone

What a powerful statement of our true condition and the complete failings of ‘progressive religion.’

That’s amazing. And to think that it was on the mainstream media.

Working on being my own hate crime

Wow!! Fantastic. 10 out of 10 - nails it.

Wow. Coozying up to TEC on my death bed and having some LBGT “Witch of Warcraft” hovering over me frightens me to the bone. Another example of why subverting and fighting from within won’t work. You’ll end up with some new age freak show giving you last rights. Instead of telling me “It’s easier to feel guilty than forgiven”, please tell me, “Your guilt shows your remorse and repentence. God loved you so much that he gave his beloved Son to save YOU! Accept this bountiful grace,  and be ready to meet Jesus in paradise.”

Crusader44

What show was that from??

ER, last episode of the show so far. Name of the episode is ‘Atonement’.

I get woolly here

Wow!!  That pretty much says it all, doesn’t it?

Wow, that actually was pretty cool.  I dont watch the show, but was she supposed to be a chaplain?  CPE anyone?  Total flashback!  I wonder if she made a verbatim of that one.  Hilarious!

What an unkind, uninclusive man.  Clearly not nuanced in his thinking and highly patriarchal to boot.  One would think that on his death bed, pondering his possible previous errors or mistakes [due to his lack of education I would think or his childhood background or his genetics] that he would willingly accept such a rosy haze of sophistication and intellect.

But no, he has to go all black and white on the poor woman.

His own emotions prohibited him from hearing the vast store of experience and speculation and intellect that she offered him.

He wasn’t worthy of her.  She needed to go to someone more in tune to the subtleties and nuances of life—perhaps a fellow progressive who had endured a slight burn in her cooking class in the room next over. 

The reason why he didn’t understand what she was saying is because she is an intellectual.

I don’t watch ER (or much of anything) but I wonder if one watched the entire episode, it would be apparent that this man is wrong for wanting straight answers from a “real chaplain.”

In an atmosphere of fear and uncertainty, it is difficult for someone to have an honest and accepting experience with the “other.”  We are all diminished by his reaction, by his rejection of the valuable gift she had to offer.  Perhaps one day he will live into her invitation to wholeness. 

On the other hand, he may become a Christian - I did not watch the show.

Be cautious of this tale. What Hollywood gives, it can also take away.  There are many possible resolutions to this plot line, and many of those will offend the Christian ear.  What I would not expect is the arrival of an orthodox chaplain presenting an orthodox gospel - all to the great joy of the dying man.  Hollywood has no concept of authentic Christianity beyond Elmer Gantry stereotypes, and so cannot give voice to it. 

Of course, the plot was not randomly included, so then what purpose does it serve?  Hollywood loves to present personal tales of personal atonement.  The dying man finds forgiveness through some supreme act of generosity or sacrifice.  It becomes yet one more version of works-righteousness toward which men naturally gravitate.  And it makes the audience feel good because atonement is presented as a task within the scope of their control.  This is where I would expect the plotline to go. 

We shall see.

carl

I love that guy!  My mom and I had been discussing the chaplain (I think her name was Julia) and how she pretty much didn’t believe in anything, she was just there to offer “comfort” and platitudes.  We literally stood up and cheered when he went off on her like that. 

Re: Anglican Xn’s question:
They show her later weeping in the ambulance bay.  Dr. Pratt finds her and tries to make her feel better, telling her that Mr. Truman didn’t mean it, and tries to get her go back in here.  I don’t remember exactly what she said, but she knows he meant exactly what he said, and stays put.  Her character most likely won’t be returning.

I had a family whose lost their 17 year old son in a car accident. They were Assemblies of God. The chaplain who showed up was this lady to a T. I called a friend who was AoG, and he had a pastor there lickety split. All wasn’t well, but it wasn’t compounded by New Age drivel.

Bah! I hit post before I was done…

Later, Truman is having flashbacks of all the men he’s executed (especially the father of the boy whose life he saved earlier in the episode, who turned out to be innocent), and tries to inject poison into his IV.  Pratt stops him and tells him that his redemption/destiny/whatever was to save the kid from drowning.

And so this plot-line ends with no mention of the real source of all forgiveness.  Since Truman was a one-episode character, we’ll never know if he found Jesus or not.

A related story….
“Having had parents in the the hospital for various ailments over recent years, it reminded me of an encounter with a hospital Chaplin. As I listened I could hear him issuing words of comfort, not relief, to a patient across from my Mom’s room who was terminal with cancer. On my way out I passed the room, heard her crying, popped my head in and asked if there was anything I could do. She said, ‘You aren’t a Chaplin are you? He’s already come.’ I told her no I wasn’t, that I overheard the discussion and it sounded like she wasn’t comforted and asked if she wanted to talk. She invited me in and we talked. Turned out she had 80 yrs of regrets and failures she needed to unload. I also found out she was Jewish, which explained the Chaplin’s vagueness. She asked me what I thought about death, what happened if you were a bad person. I told her I thought God loved her enough to provide a way to redeem her, and somewhat paraphrased Luther: ‘You, Lord Jesus, are my righteousness, but I am your sin. You have taken upon yourself what is mine and have given to me what is yours. You have taken upon yourself what you were not and have given to me what I was not.’ She started sobbing so loudly that the nurses came in and asked if I was immediate family. I told them no, and was asked to leave. I leaned over and told her trust Jesus, your Messiah, and then left. I went back the next day and she wasn’t there - not sure what happened.”
The lesson that the video illustrates is that people want real hope, not some philosophy about how everyone is good and ok - because they’re not good enough! And those closer to the grave know it!

wow, notice the “active listening” and the “reflective” responses intended to help the man discover his own answers. This woman is the picture image of CPE trained pastors. We were told NEVER to mention Jesus unless specifically asked, Never to give answers, Never to mention judgment…our task was to make the “leave-taking” as therapeutically comfortable as possible…

A number of us did not do so well in that class

Powerful

This was absurd because the guy clearly knew enough to know what he wanted and what he didn’t want.  If he was a Catholic he would have asked for a priest.  If he was a Baptist he would have asked for a pastor.  OK, he recognizes that she isn’t a “real chaplin” and that she’s there mainly to listen to him and “reflect” his feelings.  (Although actually, her comment that “sometimes it’s easier to feel guilty than to feel forgiven” was pretty good—as was her insight (not “reflected” from him) that maybe feeling guilty had become his reason for living.) 

His freaking out was complete Hollywood.  Here’s a guy who understands sin, atonement, and judgement but for some reason he doesn’t have that very last piece of the puzzle—forgiveness—and he can’t figure out how to find a “real” chaplin who might, except to screech at some woman.  (See—as a Catholic I’d know she wasn’t a “real” chaplin just by the way she was dressed.  A “real” chaplin is wearing a Roman collar or a modified habit, or if they’re a Protestant they’re carrying a Bible. )

It would have been more realistic if he were confused and uncertain and it was clear that her waffling (which I didn’t think was all that waffley as these things go) wasn’t helping him.  Anyway, this is why I don’t watch TV.

Welcome to the world of TEC (but not only them) How many are going to be lost because of them… HOW MANY?!?!?!?!?!?!

Oh sirs, surely if you had all conversed with neighbour Death as oft as I have done, and as often received the sentence in yourselves, you would have an unquiet conscience, if not a reformed life, as to your ministerial diligence and fidelity: and you would have something within you that would frequently ask you such questions as these: “Is this all thy compassion for lost sinners?  Wilt thou do no more to seek and save them?...Shall they die and be in hell before thou wilt speak to them one serious word to prevent it?  Shall they there curse thee for ever that thou didst no more in time to save them?”

Brethren, what if you heard sinners cry after you in the streets, ‘O sir, have pity on me, and afford me your advice!  I am afraid of the everlasting wrath of God.  I know I must shortly leave this world, and I am afraid lest I shall be miserable in the next.’  What if they came to your study-door, and cried for help, and would not go away till you had told them how to escape the wrath of God?  Could you find it in your hearts to drive them away without advice?
—Richard Baxter, The Reformed Pastor

How cruel to leave people facing questions of eternity on their hearts with only the answers that they can generate inside of themselves; where the questions and doubts have already taken root.  To hear the question and not point people to Christ, but to dangle them in front of their own doubts as if the doubts were a precious diamond, is unthinkable.

Title of this thread says it all…...Stands Alone

One size does not fit all. No comfort in the end for those who don’t care enough to get real with God and do the hard work of living up to and facing the sins that kept us from Him.

Hmmm… I wonder just what stands alone. I see not link or text.

Message to KJS and TEC:  Get out!  Get out!  Get out!

This is such an painfully accurate portrayal of the lethal failure of liberal theology and of the “therapeutic” approach to pastoral care that I had to first watch it in bits and pieces before I could watch it all the way through.

Although most of us, thank God, are not in extremis as is the character of the doctor, all of us are, in the ultimate sense, “running out of time.”  The conflict between these characters revolves around the issue of whether objective truth exists or doesn’t.  If it does exist, we need to try to find it as God reveals it to us, and then follow it.  If it doesn’t exist, then the tooth and claw are as valid a focus of life as anything else.

A good dramatization of what not to do as a Chaplain. The male actor has a bit too much energy to be a cancer patient in this setting. Thank goodness the “Chaplain” is not wearing a collar or a cross, neither is she wearing any kind of ID.

I am continually amazed at the wonderful opportunities are there in dealing with the dying and hurting and yet the lack of real answers the clergy have for them.  There needs to be a REAL training program for the hospice, hospital, and pastoral care area, but I fear, alas, that most of the clergy are really not interested in developing the skills necessary to deal with this.  So maybe there will be laity who will take up the challenge.

I would like to hope he got the real Message before the end.  Maybe in the form of an angel appearing as a maintenance worker mopping the floor.  Or. . .maybe. . .just an ordinary everyday Christian who is a maintenance worker mopping the floor.

Absolutely fantastic.
I also recommend a very short article by Bp. Reid of TAC in the National Post newspaper (in Canada) on the Anglican Communion. In essence you can’t be half orthodox, or half pregnant. Christianity isn’t a buffet of take what you want and reject the rest. A must read.

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=319752

God be with us.

There is a lay Chaplain training program the began at St. Lukes Hospital in Houston called the Community of Hope. We have a chapter in the upstate of South Carolina. As Episcopalians serving fellow Episcopalians, these lay people can handle just about anything. Many times they are better suited for this than seminary trained clergy.
Corpus iste a Deo factus est, inaestimabile sacramentum, irreprehensibilis est. (Sorry, I had to change Locus to Corpus to stay in context)
Community of Hope beginnings: http://www.coh-international.com/AboutUs_old/COHIBeginnings/tabid/75/Default.aspx

One of our best hospice workers was a little creole lady who was a nurse’s aide. She could connect with the terminal patient when the fancy degreed psychologists struck out. She wasn’t afraid to talk about Jesus.

On the other hand, we had a hospice in a Colorado valley crawling with wealthy out of state liberals. We had a patient who wanted someone to say the Rosary with her, and the Patient Care Committee denied her request because one of her Lib buddies said “She must have been delerious. She would be angry if someone bothered her with a Rosary.” It remains one of my worst moments in hospice work, because I didn’t argue with them. I have tried to make up for that by confronting aggresive pagans whoever and wherever they are.

We are blessed today. Until recently the national press in Canada and the US have only trumpeted the revisionist view. The tide is changing. The National Post has an article on the revisionist treachery and secularism in what they say and what they do.

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=319753

God will win out.

This brings back memories of my CPE (in which I was encouraged to speak of Jesus and did so with many patients). 

YBIC,
Phil Snyder

This little segment serves as an apt mini-indictment of what passes for “pastoral care” in much of “mainline” Christianity.  Alas, the CPE (Clinical Pastoral Education) training offered everywhere in the country these days turns out all too many hapless would-be helpers who are actually indoctrinated in a false method of offering care that avoids giving truly PASTORAL care.  It’s worse than no training at all.

I’m reminded of two quotes by great theologians of the mid 20th century (both quotes actually coming from the 1930s) that cut to the heart of what’s wrong with liberal theology.  This powerful video clip illustrates all too clearly what they were getting at.

First, Richard Neibuhr (in, if I recall correctly, “The Kingdom of God in America”), who taught at Yale Divinity School, itself a bastion of liberal Protestantism, in his most Neo-Orthodox period, summed up the failings of liberal theology perfectly in one pithy sentence.  Neibuhr castigated liberal Protestantism as being about “how a God without wrath brought men without sin into a kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a cross.”  Today, we’d avoid the exclusive language (“men” without sin), but this devastating and unforgettable charge still rings true today, describing all too well the dominant working theology of clergy and lay leaders in TEC.

Second, there are the famous opening lines of Dietrich Bonhoeffer’s great classic, “The Cost of Discipleship.”  I can’t quote it from memory accurately, and but the gist of it was something like this:
“Our mortal enemy today is ‘cheap grace.’  What we are fighting for is ‘costly grace.’”  And as Bonhoeffer went on to explain so clearly and forcefully, “cheap grace” is the offer of absolution without repentance, salvation without faith and obedience etc.  As a faithful German Lutheran, Bonhoeffer was distressed at how Luther’s doctrine of justification by faith was being totally debased and distorted in the working theology of the majority of clergy, who were in captivity to the perverse ideology of the Nazis.  TEC is just as much in bondage today, and we have no excuse that a totalitarian police state is forcing its will on us.  We have willingly given ourselves over to the lie.

In effect, liberal leaders (and CPE instructors) in all the so-called “mainline” churches are well-intentioned but cruel tyrants who bid ministers and chaplains “make bricks without straw,” i.e., by telling them to offer spiritual comfort without using the true gospel.  They take away the hammer, and then wonder why so few nails are pounded in.

David Handy+

His freaking out was complete Hollywood.  Here’s a guy who understands sin, atonement, and judgement but for some reason he doesn’t have that very last piece of the puzzle—forgiveness

Actually, his freaking out is consistent with Romans 1, sans the pressure-cooker denial.  Natural Revelation tells us that we are under judgment;  but it does not reveal how to be forgiven, as Special Revelation does.

One size does not fit all. No comfort in the end for those who don’t care enough to get real with God and do the hard work of living up to and facing the sins that kept us from Him.

My mother wouldn’t.  She chose to undergo deep sedation for “existential agnst”  (in other words, she was afraid to die, and wouldn’t run to God).  You can’t eat or drink whilst under deep sedation, so it doesn’t take you very long to die.  And yes, sadly, this seems to be legal in Canada.

I wanted to scream at the computer——it is called confession and absolution.  The grace of this sacrament is something that I wish all could experience.  That is one place the RC’s have it on us; they require the sacrament once a year.

#37, terrafirma,

I join you in fervently wishing all Anglicans would overcome their fears and make use of this tremendous sacrament.  I’m fond of invoking the example of C. S. Lewis, who long resisted the idea of making a confession in front of a priest.  But once he actually did it, he found it so helpful that he went to confession on virtually a weekly basis, not because he had to, like pre-Vatican II RCs, but because he wanted to.

Perhaps you are aware of the old traditional Anglican adage about the sacrament of reconciliation:  “All may (go), none must, some should.”  After 20 years of parish ministry, seeing how fruitful it is for so many people (including myself), I like to paraphrase that old saying this way:  “All may, none must, MORE should.”

David Handy+