Stand Firm Table at Diocesan Convention Vandalized

“indaba” - In-da-ba (noun) - 1. the act of vandalizing anything associated with those who oppose your opinion.

Greg - now you know listening only means listening to the other side telling you that you are a homophobic, people hating person. What they did seems to fit with that model.

See, Greg, you are allowed to have your opinions, and you will be offered an honored place in TEC because TEC is an inclusive church that provides a place for everyone.  But you can’t actually advocate for your opinions because that would mean oppressing someone else.  Your table was hurtful, and hateful, and oppressive.  So these unknown individuals simply acted to remove the hurt, and hate, and offense that you so callously thrust into their midst.  They weren’t trying to remove you.  They were acting to prevent you from being hurtful, and hateful, and oppressive.  If you had simply kept your opinions to yourself, and hadn’t set up that hurtful, hateful,  oppressive table in the first place, then they wouldn’t have to act in defense of the hurt, the hated, the oppressed.  It’s really all your fault, Greg.  You should probably apologize for making them take your material.  I am sure it grieved them to have to act in such a manner.

carl

Clarity is a good thing. They were only acting in accordance with their true nature.

Bravo Carl, bravo!

So Greg, did they just take your handouts, or did they take the display board and such too???

~jacob

If it wasn’t the leaders of the committee themselves who vandalized the table, then they almost certainly know who did it. I will expect them to bring those persons to full account.

Have you been practicing holding your breath?  It’s gonna be a long convention.

Jacobsladder,

They stole everything but one box of brochures that was underneath the table.

Where in Mississippi is the convention? I am sorry to hear this of my old diocese, it would not have happened when I was there. People may have wanted to silence dissent in such an ugly way, but would have been too polite. It really is theft, but of more then things… Reminds me of an old saying, “Give them an inch, and they will take a table.”

I know it is in Tupelo, but what location is what I meant. The convention center is public property, so you should report it.

FrVan,

It wouldn’t matter whether it was public or private property; theft is theft regardless of who owns the venue.

We’re definitely considering reporting it as theft to the Tupelo police dept.

Integrity

Inclusion.  Feel the love.

I guess the “T” stands for “Thieves” now.

Greg,

I urge you to report it to the Tupelo police.  Sometimes unresovled crimes such as this are solved in later cases and might help prove a pattern of offenses which might influence a judge dealing with the later offense.

Upon reflection, I would hope the bishop, or his canon, would mention during the meeting.

In the meantime Greg, prayers ascending for the SF team in all its different locales…

Sounds like a planned act, for sure, but one coming out of desperation.  An organization with actual integrity would not abide such action among its devotees and members and would denounce same with alacrity.  (Wonder why so much angst and desperation among revisionists lately, hmmm?)

Hope you took pictures…

“Men love darkness rat
her than light, because THEIR DEEDS ARE EVIL”  Sounds like you have just smoked them out and revealed what type of people they really are.  If you had a bishop with the right balance of hormones, he would just ban them from the dioscese.  They could go off and abuse themselves away from civilized people, IMHO Also, the police need to have a formal complaint and investigate.  Also, be sure the people in Tupelo know what happened.

Given the millions and millions of dollars worth of real estate the same group has “Stolen”, I find it hard to get upset about some material they don’t want you to read. After all they have already the stolen the buildings they don’t want you to pray in.

RE: “I urge you to report it to the Tupelo police.”

I wholeheartedly agree.  It’s best to get the secular authorities involved in these issues, considering who and what TEC liberals are.

At least you know that your brochures went to the needy.

I agree with Sarah.  This kind of thievery is despicable.

I wouldn’t expect a lot of enthusiasm from the police.

Greg,
I would replace the stolen material with the posting from #9. episcopalienated on the following thread DioMS: Annual Report from Gay & Lesbian Ministry. “And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, and they did not love their lives to the death.” (Rev. 12:11).

I think it important to pray for the person(s) involved in this act and for the Lesbian Gay Bi-sexual Transgendered Committee.  Remember that we are warned not to let the sun go down on our anger.

Dear Heavenly Father,
Love them and bless them. Amen.

Prayers for the Council can be found here.

from Tupelo: The Bishop did report and lament the “vandalism”, and noted that it was indefensable and had no place here or anywhere. The chair of the Comm on Ministry to Gays and Lesbians expressed sorrow and denied any participation by his folks. The leader of SF expressed sorrow, pain and thanks for the words of condemnation.
Greg, I would report it to the police. If they find the dumped material they might get prints. Could it be considered a hate crime? And I would alert the press. The only way to clean dirty underwear is exposure to bright sunshine.

Don’t just involve the local police. Get the FBI involved as a…hate crime!

it would have been far better for those who appose you to have let you whine and freak out without stealing your materials. Your own rhetoric turns more people away from you than your opponents.
splendid examples are available in this one thread line.

whining.
Greg - now you know listening only means listening to the other side telling you that you are a homophobic, people hating person. What they did seems to fit with that model.

freaking out
Don’t just involve the local police. Get the FBI involved as a…hate crime!

[27] Clete

I take it you aren’t familiar with the concept of irony, are you.

carl

Hey Clete,

Can we have our stuff back?

What say you give us our stuff, and I’ll try and find a sense of humor I can give you.

kthxbai

Clete, are you saying that it’s alright to swipe things like those papers from the Stand Firm table, and that we so-called “homophobic people-hating persons” are somehow wrong if we call the police?  Wouldn’t you do the same, if some group did the same to your group?

Cenny,

If that happened the other way around - if the LGBT materials had been stolen, and replaced by SF stuff, the place would be under lockdown. There would be media and law enforcement setting up a perimeter. The wailing and crying would be heard all the way to Jackson.

Pathetic! It sure show how small whomever the name is on that card. I’ve down some stupid things in my youth and hung around others who did worse, as in smashing windshields outside DC Space for no good reason, but this is worse because it just smells of malice, angst worst than our then - worse the individual[s] probably some yuppie type, so if judged on mere appearance most would not suspect the depth of darkness in their heart, a double life for a low life ... pathetic!

Does Stand Firm have a table at all - most - many diocesan conventions?  My mind is whirling just imagining the reactions - yes plural! - at my former diocese!  I helped man the American Anglican Council display at the last convention I attended.  That was an “experience”, in both agony and blessing!

Donna,

No, we usually have on just at the Miss. council, although I’d love to hear from anyone who’s interested in setting one up at their own convention.

Clete, there’s no excuse for this or any kind of straight-bashing, or other expressions of heterophobia.

Score -1 point for the malakoi!

By the way, Clete, I’ll bet Greg is smart enough to find your IP address, so keep those cards and letters coming.

Hey Greg,

You could always hand out the GLBT material to folks, and then when they do a double-take it’ll give you the opportunity to say “well, someone stole all our hand-outs, and replaced them with these, don’t know who could’a done it, but here it is”. Might be worth a few yucks.

Yours in Christ,
jacob

Greg,  I think you have a great opportunity here.  Why don’t you pack up all the bookmarks and literature left on the table after the theft of your stuff and Fed Ex them to England for distribution to Synod as a gift from TEC?

By the way, are we talking stolen literature and I LIKE IKER t-shirts, or are we talking stolen laptops and AV set ups?

tj, it was literature, but the thought that this might be an opportunity for an overhaul of the way we’ve done it in the past has already come up.

If you read my note, I clearly state that it would have been better for people not to have done anything to the exhibit.  let me put it simply so you will understand. I don’t approve of theft or vandalism.

Greg, you actually do have a sense of humor. May I borrow it sometime? I promise to return it with very little use.

Cenny, I dont have a group.

Ralph, what are you suggesting Greg would do to me if he found my ip address.

An example of “tolerance”, and “the ends justifying the means”.

Thanks Jill (39),
What I was actually worried about was not relative intrinsic value of what was stolen, but whether thieves had gotten hold of, say, Greg’s laptop with research, mailing lists, passwords, my secret identity- that kind of stuff.
  I’ll assume someone has checked with building management on whether the security cameras show anything, whether anyone requested after hours access, things like that. Unless, of course, it is a church parish hall, in which case you might suspect someone who has the keys.
  You never know, the Lord does work in mysterious ways- maybe one of the culprits will read some of what they stole on the way to Damascus.

Clete, I would have hoped that the ellipsis and the exclamation point would have clued you in that my post was meant to be tongue in cheek.

As one of the tolerated liberals here, let me say a couple things:

1) The conduct is simply wrong and deserving of condemnation.

2) Any leader of any group, including for instance any AC-NA bishop knows that he will be blamed when his followers act badly and that he cannot always stop them from doing that.  It is not fair, but it is very human.

3) If you can identify the perps; call the cops.  It is entirely appropriate that those who violate your rights and the law face the prosecutor.

FWIW
jimB

I love Jill Woodliff and the way she focuses on things above.  God bless you Jill and family.

#40, Clete. Greg’s a crazy, wacko IT person (even more than usual for an IT guy) who happens to be an Episcopalian. I don’t think he has a sense of humor at all. There’s NO TELLING what he would do with your IP address if he had reason to believe that you’re one of the perps. Any speculation on my part would be wrong.

While on principle one should report stolen items to the police, somehow I doubt you are going to get a CSI unit showing up doing a finger print search.

You did have someone check the brochures left behind for incriminating brimstone traces, right?

I was at council and walked around the various booths but didn’t see the Stand Firm booth. I was sorry to have missed it.My daughter was our delegate this year and I was proud of her standing up to speak in favor of one of the conservative resolutions.

Hey, does anybody know when the English are going to vote on whether they like us or not?

Friday, or so I’m told.

Provided, of course, that Schori doesn’t manage to have it torpedoed first.

Friday, or so I’m told.

Good, whoever has been moderating the HoBD listserve needs a day off.  Incredible, isn’t it, over a week and not a single mention of Bishop Mouneer, or the CoE resolution, or the Synod for that matter, or the Covenant, or the Archbishop of Canterbury.

Unfortunately, as a rule, they schedule for Fridays the contentious votes that the Archbishops would like to see put off for a Synod or two.

Just one more thing to add to this dialogue.  The action taken against Stand Firm in Tupelo was not the first public action taken against Stand Firm at a Diocesan Council.
Approximately 5 years ago Council met in Natchez.  At that time Stand Firm was a fairly new organization.  We had several candidates nominated for various elected positions that were to be voted on at that meeting on Saturday.  A very large display of the nominees was hung on the wall in the exhibition area.  After the initial meeting on Friday night someone stole Stand Firm lapel stickers from our booth and placed them on the photos of the candidates who were nominated by Stand Firm.  The photos of the other candidates were not touched.
To the best of my knowledge, there was no public acknowledgment by anyone at that Council regarding the incident.  It was merely swept under the rug.  After that incident we chose to “turn the other cheek”.
However, continuing these actions is just wrong, particularly in a meeting of Christians.  I will be interested in knowing the outcome of this most recent public attack against Stand Firm.