February 28, 2017

February 11, 2012

Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you Katherine Ragsdale, Dean of EDS

Julius Streicher would be proud

It’s nice that the interviewer makes her look like the death cultist she is.

Share this story:

Recent Related Posts



Rather you didn’t but I already saw her on O’Reilly. All I can say is that I am glad I am not in TEC anymore.

[1] Posted by martin5 on 2-11-2012 at 01:20 PM · [top]

This folks is the face of evil.

[2] Posted by Br. Michael on 2-11-2012 at 01:34 PM · [top]

I was surprised at how reasonable she seemed. Not at all what I expected. Either she was coached very well, is not the raving lunatic I have been led to think she is, or has had a change in perspective. If she had allowed the question to chase after deeper issues, I am sure I would have been less favorably impressed.

[3] Posted by FrVan on 2-11-2012 at 01:38 PM · [top]

I also saw O’Reilly and just sent a message to Sarah she should watch.  Part of my communication to Sarah:

Last evening I was watching some of the C-Pac coverage on Fox and was absolutely embarrassed every time the guest name and position appeared.  The guest for a segment was some throw back to the 60’s era liberal Katherine Ragsdale, Pres or Chancellor of Episcopal Divinity School in Boston.  Although Schori does create an element of constant embarrassment it was nothing like this woman.  If ever there was a poster child for what Rush calls the Fem.-N___ it would be this retro long haired scary looking woman.  She actually called abortion a “blessing”.  Laura gave her at least 3 opportunities to restate or back track on the comment. This belligerent, condescending, and arrogant old throw back has been was adamant abortion was a blessing just like cardiac surgery.

Regardless of my position to see this clergy person in charge of the training of the next generation of Priest was just astonishing.  I am one of those that have remained adamant the left wing would not drive me from The Episcopal Church but it does become increasingly more difficult especially when more are departing leaving it more difficult to turn the ship around with every defection

[4] Posted by tom3111 on 2-11-2012 at 01:46 PM · [top]

The opening by the President shows how smug and arrogant the man is.

On the subject of Katherine Ragsdale…  “won the applause”??? Really.  How mendacious can a person be?  She comes off as an Obama cheerleader.  So we sacrifice the religious liberty of conscience bound dissenter payers for the religious liberty of those who “need this health care”.

Matt+, you’re correct.  Her bob and weave rhetoric is characteristic of someone who is entirely a political animal, having no concern whatsoever about the rights of all. That’s awfully non-Episcopalian—-these revisionist taskmasters keep telling everyone about the importance of our baptismal covenant.

ex.  Celebrant:  Will you strive for justice and peace among all people, and respect the dignity of every human being?
People:        I will, with God’s help.
(Book of Common Prayer, p. 304)

It is assuredly the intent of Ragsdale to disrespect the dignity of dissenters.

How in the bluest of blue blazes can anyone in her position spout such dangerous garbage as she and still be in holy orders??????? In former days a cleric such as she would be defrocked faster than PB Jefferts Schori today can say “live into the tension”.  Clearly TEC lives in an evil alternate universe from actual, classical Anglicanism.  If no one in positions of ecclesial authority over her speak up directly to censure Ragsdale, then TEC has fully and irreversibly submerged itself into the culture of death, the complete antithesis of Deuteronomy 30:11-20TEC’s apostasy will therefore be complete.  It will be the anti-church.

Technically, Ragsdale’s orders never actually were conferred, as she is so far off the Gospel standard in every way as to have made them null and void.

Katherine Ragsdale’s position is utterly fascist. She is a dangerous person who should be kept far, far, far, far away from any lever of any hint of any power whatsoever.

“I give you Katherine Ragsdale…”

No, thanks!

[5] Posted by Athanasius Returns on 2-11-2012 at 01:47 PM · [top]

Abortion, heart transplants, and cardiac surgery are similar blessings to Ragsdale+. Ugh.

[6] Posted by Undergroundpewster on 2-11-2012 at 02:36 PM · [top]

And notice how is now considered discrimination for other not to pay for another contraception and abortions.  Notice how she twists the freedom to have contraception and abortions into the duty and obligation of others to pay for it.  Just as you might pay to have a broken leg set you now must pay to have a life terminated.

[7] Posted by Br. Michael on 2-11-2012 at 02:39 PM · [top]

I am absolutely disgusted by that woman!  Her attitude towards the difference (there is none) between preventing the need for insurance to cover heart transplants (to save lives) and abortions (to take infant lives) is appalling!

[8] Posted by cennydd13 on 2-11-2012 at 02:49 PM · [top]

According to her, it’s somehow OK to save a human life via heart transplant, but NOT OK to save a life by letting an infant go full term to live birth if the mother doesn’t want the child.

[9] Posted by cennydd13 on 2-11-2012 at 02:55 PM · [top]

Ragsdale reminded me of a clever seminary-based Screwtape—with such a nice, disarming smile!

After last night’s audition, don’t you think she’d be a worthy successor to Schori?

[10] Posted by hanks on 2-11-2012 at 03:16 PM · [top]

Forcing insurance companies to pay for contraception is idiocy. Forcing those employers who are opposed to contraceptives to pay for insurance that is mandated to cover contraception is idiocy. The thinking that it is a basic “right” for everyone to have free contraceptives is idiocy (we already have such a free plan called abstinence). And #3 Fr. Van get a grip. What did you expect, for her to be foaming at the mouth and raving about the gloriousness of infanticide? Satan’s helpers can sound and appear reasonable. Seeing her mug up there with her collar makes me want to vomit. I am so glad to be out of TEC.

[11] Posted by via orthodoxy on 2-11-2012 at 03:34 PM · [top]

“If no one in positions of ecclesial authority over her speak up directly to censure Ragsdale,”

Good grief, I’ve stooped so low as to quote from my previous post. Hold on just a sec…

Bunches and bunches of times many of us here at beautiful downtown StandFirm have begged for higher-ups to bishop up and call blind guides onto the carpet.  Since with V E R Y few exceptions (Bishop Wolf and Bishop Lawrence come to mind) TEC bishops have much less spine than the calamari we’re about to consume for an appetizer, howz about some hearty TEC priests gut check themselves and D E M A N D (yup, D E M A N D) that Ragsdale be inhibited, deposed, and tossed out of TEC altogether.  Seems maybe some WWII kommandants demonstrated more soul than does Ragsdale.

The fact that she remains where she is with impunity is a full indictment of the dreg-sopped depths to which TEC management is determined to descend taking thousands with them.


[12] Posted by Athanasius Returns on 2-11-2012 at 05:17 PM · [top]

I too saw this interview. It was the pits. It’s humiliating to be connected in any way, shape, or form with the church in which this woman is responsible for training future priests. To hear her compare abortion to heart surgery was one of the most disgusting things I’ve ever heard one of these people who espouse the culture of death say.

I am one of those that have remained adamant the left wing would not drive me from The Episcopal Church but it does become increasingly more difficult especially when more are departing leaving it more difficult to turn the ship around with every defection .

I think it’s impossible to turn the ship around at this point. I think Schori, Ragsdale, and people like them are far too powerful and have far too big a majority at the convention for the rest of us to have any effect at all on what happens. I think that’s been true for a long time. I think that this upcoming general convention is going to present those of us still in TEC who are actually Christians - that is, followers of Christ - with a real crisis. I think if we have any integrity at all we’re going to have to do something, because if we haven’t gotten the picture already, we’ll certainly have it after the convention.

[13] Posted by Nellie on 2-11-2012 at 06:15 PM · [top]

Athanasius Returns, your point about Episcopal priests with any spine left speaking up and demanding that Ragsdale get the axe is well taken.  If there ARE any such priests left in TEC, they’ll do what’s right….or they’ll keep their mouths shut for fear that Schori will “inhibit” or “depose” them, which would tell me that they care more for simply remaining where they are than for standing up for the Truth.  Or maybe they’re concerned about their pensions and don’t want to risk them

[14] Posted by cennydd13 on 2-11-2012 at 06:54 PM · [top]

And there is no point in staying in an organization in which the liberal leadership is so firmly embedded with the Devil!

[15] Posted by cennydd13 on 2-11-2012 at 07:08 PM · [top]

Don’t forget that this is the lesbian gal that “married” the female canon of the diocese of massachusetts, presided over by the gay, “celibate” bishop shaw, and who I believe was a board memberr of naral (someone wih a stronger stomach can go back and confirm that last one), and she was the head of a left-wing hit-group whose purpose it was to attack the right.

[16] Posted by paradoxymoron on 2-11-2012 at 07:52 PM · [top]

[7] Br. Michael,

Your comment

Notice how she twists the freedom to have contraception and abortions into the duty and obligation of others to pay for it.

seems to imply that it requires some sort of intellectual gymnastics to move from asserting that members of some class of people have a right, to the conclusion that others have a corresponding obligation. Therein lies the problem of declaring the existence of rights that are not given us by God, but simply enacted by a legislature. Almost every human law that asserts a right inhering to me establishes, well nigh automatically and necessarily, a corresponding duty on the part of everyone else in society—namely, to avoid interfering with my exercise of that right.

I do not believe that others have an obligation to incur a cost to enable me to exercise my rights, but that is a distinction that many ordinary folk do not immediately recognize, particularly when they accept the idea that they have the right in question. We need a concerted effort to remind everyone that the law is given by God as are true rights, while that which is called law is frequently only legislation, which is an altogether different beast.

Pax et bonum,
Keith Töpfer

[17] Posted by Militaris Artifex on 2-11-2012 at 09:34 PM · [top]

You had me when she said she was quite pleased and impressed that he managed this (phony deceitful) compromise.

[18] Posted by Intercessor on 2-11-2012 at 10:29 PM · [top]

I Made it to 3:44 the first time through before bailing out.  Almost bailed out at 6:21 the second time but stuck it out to the agonizing end.  Will Obamacare pay for a new computer monitor, if I destroyed my first one for “therapeutic” reasons?

I don’t know how much Laura Ingraham (former speech writer in the Reagan administration and law clerk for Justice Clarence Thomas, in case you aren’t familiar with her) got paid for conducting that interview, but it wasn’t enough.

[19] Posted by ToAllTheWorld on 2-11-2012 at 10:34 PM · [top]

She’s evil incarnate, of course, but I have to give her credit for one thing: She was the “last straw” that finally drove my family and me out of TEc. Big ups for that!

[20] Posted by polycarp on 2-11-2012 at 11:20 PM · [top]

Come now folks.  She’s the “moderate” face of a “mainline” denomination.

Ala the Catholic bishops reading their opposition letters in their parishes, I think this video should be be REQUIRED to be played in all TEO parishes next Sunday.

I have to admit, they say there’s more to life than looks, but zowy, if she ain’t the portrait of Dorian Grey…..

[21] Posted by Bill2 on 2-11-2012 at 11:23 PM · [top]

I think the Rev. Ragsdale was rather coy about her “Abortion is a Blessing” statements because she realizes that she would be informing, not only the public, but also Episcopalians about their church’s aggressive Pro-Abortion agenda and that might just slow things down a bit..
Her “Abortion is a Blessing” speech can be found at yet another (probably non profit) Pro-Abortion site named “AMPLIFY“..

[22] Posted by Betty See on 2-12-2012 at 01:10 AM · [top]

At 2:30 Ragsdale’s cute little smuggy smirk flashes as she wittily flips the intended moral question over to a contrast with the needs (read “justice”) of the woman or girl looking for contractives, and - as the questioning reveals - is her moral right to receive the finances for that decision from her employer.

What hypocrisy.  She later vociferously complains (5:40, 6:00, 6:14 complete with smug smirk witty attempt at end-of-question analogy) of Laura’s turning the discussion to the most extreme form of contraception, that is abortion.  (Quite Valid, I might add, and in fact a distinct part of the whereas’s and the resolution of the Pastoral Resolution passed by General Convention years ago regarding abortion). And then she goes on to completely dehumanize the baby (she would say fetus, but I never heard her say even that - only the most anti-pastoral, anti-human ‘have an abortion.’).

My guess is she went on to be interviewed quite content with her intellectual and rhetorical ability to handle whatever came her way.  Certainly she was smart enough, or only alert enough to know the setting and the interviewer.

She must be intelligent, confident and congenial, perhaps even dashing, or else she would not have risen to Deanship.
However, watching this interview I am left with the impression of a smug academic with a bullying (and yet seemingly fragile) conviction of her own thought processes as always being correct, even better.  A person such as that in the position of singular authority in an institution’s institution is almost the scenario of an anarchist in a candy store.

Unlike her paternalistic and patronizing statements about how the Catholic Church (the Roman Catholic Church) has the right to believe and teach what they choose (wasn’t that nice of her to grant such?), she, as the Dean of a Seminary, does not have that right.  Perhaps as a non-administrative faculty member; but not as the Dean.

[23] Posted by Rob Eaton+ on 2-12-2012 at 01:29 AM · [top]

Sorry for the SP in the first sentence—obviously not “contractives”, but “contraceptives”.

[24] Posted by Rob Eaton+ on 2-12-2012 at 01:33 AM · [top]

This from Episcopal News Service…
“Ragsdale, a 1997 graduate of EDS, comes to the school from Political Research Associates, a progressive think tank, where she has served as president and executive director since 2005. During her tenure, PRA has both broadened its donor base and worked with foundations to launch several new programs. Ragsdale has served on the boards of The White House Project, NARAL Pro-Choice America , and the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice , among others. She has served as vicar of St. David’s Church since 1996.”

Evidently leaders of the church think that membership in pro-abortion organizations qualifies a person for a high position. I wonder if that is why there are so many of them.

[25] Posted by Betty See on 2-12-2012 at 02:15 AM · [top]

Keith, I agree with you on the concept of rights.  The word has been cheapened to basically mean a government granted privilege, which is of course, no right at all.  Rights are transcendent and pre-date government.  They are outside government’s power to either grant or deny.  Our form of Constitutional government was designed to protect those rights.

But I did not use the word “right”.  I said freedom.  To be free to buy contraceptives does not, or should not in any sane society, imply the corresponding obligation of others to pay for it.  It is the liberal welfare state that does that.  And as we are seeing the liberal welfare state is only a watered down (maybe not watered down) form of totalitarianism in that it seeks to control and compel people to do another’s bidding.

[26] Posted by Br. Michael on 2-12-2012 at 07:18 AM · [top]

FrVan:  “I was surprised at how reasonable she seemed.”

What…you expect Satan to come through the television screen with a pitch fork and pointed tail?  Give him some credit.

[27] Posted by midwestnorwegian on 2-12-2012 at 08:52 AM · [top]

No. 23: “However, watching this interview I am left with the impression of a smug academic….”

She’s an academic? She has a D.Min. I’d say that she had the credentials that TEC (EDS) was looking for.

[28] Posted by David Hein on 2-12-2012 at 10:52 AM · [top]

[26] Br. Michael,

Please forgive me for being less than clear. I was not implying that you had asserted the idea that this was a “right,” only that when the language of rights is used inaptly, as it has been by Obama and many other supporters of PPACA, it triggers a virtually automatic logical linkage in the minds of the hearer to the implicit conclusion that a corresponding obligation is thereby imposed on others, absent an immediate corrective that rights are given, not by the legislature, but by God.

If we are to successfully combat that automatic and fallacious response in the listener, we must be alert continuously to remind people that human law is incapable of establishing human rights, it is only capable of affirming the rights inherent to us from our creator.

I view the foregoing as a corollary to the necessity of always calling actions, especially evil actions, by their rightful names. E.g., the willful termination of a pregnancy is a form of infanticide*, it is not contraception. Being opposed to the willful termination of a pregnancy is not being pro-choice, it is being pro-abortion.  Being opposed to the willful termination of a pregnancy, while being pro-life, is more clearly being anti-abortion.

If the general public, the electorate, is not continually faced with the rightful names of the choices they face, many will cheerfully accept the evil, provided only that they are not required to face up to calling that evil by its correct name.
*—In support of this assertion, consider the laws on the books of many U. S. jurisdictions that consider the death of an unborn infant resulting from a battery on its pregnant mother as manslaughter, or murder in some degree.

Pax et bonum,
Keith Töpfer

[29] Posted by Militaris Artifex on 2-12-2012 at 12:19 PM · [top]

It seems to me that one of the primary supporters of “reproductive choice” are lesbians for whom the issue is largely moot, the other being ardent (straight) feminists.  I’m coming to the conclusion that the issue is not about choices or healthcare but about thwarting nature and the male role in it.  Face it, the basic facts of life don’t change whether you approach from a Biblical perspective or a pagan perspective.  They want to be in control, not God (or Gaia).

[30] Posted by Nikolaus on 2-12-2012 at 12:28 PM · [top]

Keith, I agree with you.  In fact a lot, and on the left almost all, of political speech consists in playing word game and using a word, whose normal usage says one thing, to mean another.  The term is Aesopian language (conveying an innocent meaning to an outsider but a hidden meaning to a member of a conspiracy or underground movement).  For example using the term “assault weapon” to imply “machine gun” when the words really refers to common semi-automatic firearm.

The technique is to mislead and win by causing deliberate confusion.

[31] Posted by Br. Michael on 2-12-2012 at 03:21 PM · [top]

For those hoping to “turn the TEC ship around”, I think Sarah’s hope as I glean it from her many posts is both more realistic and more productive, not to mention less maddening and far more gratifying to the conservative holdouts/thorns in KJS’ side.  The hope is not to turn the ship around but to regroup with and aid such survivors as remain when the leaky, storm-battered hulk finally runs aground and the waves finish tearing it to pieces, the survivors clinging to floating wreckage to land alive on the shore a la Paul.  Fr.Van, a word to the wise is sufficient.  If God has better than that bleak scenario in mind for TEC, so much the better, but all the signs point otherwise.

[32] Posted by Milton on 2-12-2012 at 06:15 PM · [top]

Don’t they pay this woman enough at EDS so she can buy a bottle of shampoo?

[33] Posted by Bill2 on 2-12-2012 at 07:24 PM · [top]

Hey folks, please don’t make comments about her physical appearance.  There is plenty to despise in her character, actions, beliefs/ideas, rhetoric, personality, etc, to leave the appearance out of it.

[34] Posted by Sarah on 2-12-2012 at 07:48 PM · [top]

32.  Milton, in 2006, I chose not to cling to the flotsam and jetsam left when TEC ran aground and began to be pounded to pieces, and it doesn’t surprise me that Sarah and others chose to stay to try to “regroup,” as you say.  I congratulate them for that effort, but for so many of us, it was a lost cause.  Instead, like so many others, I chose the ACNA, and I’ve never been sorry that I did.  Sure, we have our share of problems, but at least we haven’t sprung any leaks.

[35] Posted by cennydd13 on 2-13-2012 at 12:17 AM · [top]

David (28),
I won’t argue with you, but I did preface that whole pictorial paragraph with the phrase “..left with the impression of…” (bold added).
She is good at leaving an impression; I’m not sure the one I described is the one she was looking for.

[36] Posted by Rob Eaton+ on 2-13-2012 at 01:45 AM · [top]

[comment deleted—off topic]

[37] Posted by Real Toral on 2-13-2012 at 09:17 AM · [top]

Surprisingly, I thourougly agree with almost every comment on this thread. My own children saw the interview and were disgusted at this woman and her words! Maybe she should be on TV more! It will do wonders for church growth and would provide the next generation of Episcopalians, few as they may be, a role model not to follow! Thankfully she and her peers are not getting any younger…nor developing any sense of style!

[38] Posted by seraph on 2-13-2012 at 09:43 AM · [top]

If one listens to the interview, I still think the Dean seemed reasonable. I saw nothing that should create the vitriol and hatred she seemed to inspire. I am speaking of course to this on sound bite. If one were to compare what the Dean said as opposed to the responses she got, she comes across as a very gracious person. Certainly in this forum.

[39] Posted by FrVan on 2-13-2012 at 04:34 PM · [top]

I despise what she stands for, Fr Van.

[40] Posted by cennydd13 on 2-13-2012 at 05:23 PM · [top]

Fr. Van, not to be argumentative, but I think, given that this is a Christian blog, you misuse the term “gracious”.  I assume what you mean is “polite” or “well mannered”.  Gracious would imply “filled with grace” or “in a manner consistent with grace”, and I cannot imagine that is what you mean, unless you have given up on the “faith once delivered” and opted for the “post-Christian” doctrines that Ragsdale preaches.  One cannot, by definition, “in a state of grace” promote abortion and heresy.  Let’s remember this is the woman who gave us the following, shortly before being elevated to Dean of one of our oldest seminaries:

And when a woman becomes pregnant within a loving, supportive, respectful relationship; has every option open to her; decides she does not wish to bear a child; and has access to a safe, affordable abortion — there is not a tragedy in sight — only blessing. The ability to enjoy God’s good gift of sexuality without compromising one’s education, life’s work, or ability to put to use God’s gifts and call is simply blessing.

These are the two things I want you, please, to remember — abortion is a blessing and our work is not done. Let me hear you say it: abortion is a blessing and our work is not done. Abortion is a blessing and our work is not done. Abortion is a blessing and our work is not done.

This interview is a continuation of the work she began with her speech.

[41] Posted by tjmcmahon on 2-13-2012 at 06:05 PM · [top]

RE: “I am speaking of course to this on sound bite.”

You’ve inspired me, Father Van.

I hereby declare this week at StandFirm to be “Katherine Ragsdale Week.”

[42] Posted by Sarah on 2-13-2012 at 06:40 PM · [top]

I’m surprised Fr. Van that you think comparing a baby to heart disease comes off as reasonable.

[43] Posted by Matt Kennedy on 2-13-2012 at 07:44 PM · [top]

That woman thinks the deliberate killing of an unborn human being (Oh, I forgot….it’s a mere clump of cells until you can detect a heartbeat, isn’t it?) is somehow a “blessing” just because it’s somehow “inconvenient” because giving birth to another person might interfere with her career?  MY GOD….talk about being self-centered!  “It’s all about ME, isn’t it?”

[44] Posted by cennydd13 on 2-13-2012 at 11:00 PM · [top]

I was glad that Laura Ingraham showed righteous indignation when Rev. Ragsdale accused Catholic institutions of being coercive. I can understand why Ingraham resented Ragsdale’s attempt to use her show to tarnish the reputation of Catholic institutions and it was absolutely necessary that Ingraham correct Rev. Ragsdales erroneous and inappropriate statement.
It occurs to me that the Episcopal church might have remained an unquestionably Christian church if more of our Bishops had been willing to show righteous indignation at a time when it was appropriate to do so.

[45] Posted by Betty See on 2-13-2012 at 11:05 PM · [top]

Fr. Matt: I think you should not be surprised that in a discussion of “contraception,” that I think she did well not to be ambushed into a discussion of something other. The discussion at hand was not about anything more, no matter how the field was baited, then a woman’s right to seek medical care. Where someone goes in a health-care emergency, and the outcome to life could well have to do with how far, how expensive, how credible, etc., the medical team is performing the procedure. I would like to think that, as one with 7 bypasses, in an emergency, if I had only two health-care options to choose from, and it was a Christian Scientist Hospital, or a Planned Parenthood clinic, that the procedure could be done in a hospital setting…Elective surgery is different, and I think so is the issue of abortion…It is like comparing apples and oranges, or babies and heart procedures.

As to a Dean Ragsdale Week, Sarah,that is a “good” idea? But I am glad I gave you an inspiration, I didn’t think you would give a hoot about my opinion, and I am shocked (though given the topic, not flattered)... You have given me many, as has Matt, and enriched my life, truly. I am grateful…But remember, the interview was my introduction to the “creature,” other than opinions I’d read on these “pages.” And she came across without the two heads, foaming at the mouth, and the Wiccan stuff, I’d expected. Though she does seem to bring those elements out in others…If you wanted me to have been influenced about the interview, to have her properly vilified, and folks like me to stand in lock-step, maybe you should have added the interview AFTER the Love-Fest week of Ragsdale’s greatest hits….Oh Bother… 

TJ, “Gracious” was the wrong word…

[46] Posted by FrVan on 2-13-2012 at 11:57 PM · [top]

Fr.Van, I really don’t see how you can think Ragsdale was “ambushed” into anything. And a “woman’s right to seek medical care”? Who’s objecting to a woman’s right to seek medical care? I don’t define medical care as murdering another human being to get rid of the “disease” of pregnancy. That woman - Ragsdale - is a disgusting monster who masquerades as a Christian. Equating a heart transplant with abortion is one of the most extreme, radical, irrationally anti-life things I have ever heard. I was revolted by it, as any true Christian would be. What would Christ say about this interview - that Laura was unfair in some way to this reasonable woman Ragsdale? I don’t think so.

[47] Posted by Nellie on 2-14-2012 at 12:29 AM · [top]

She really did avoid the issue at the end though, given her honest love of abortion. We all know what she said in the speech that TJ quoted, and yet in this interview she blithely dismisses any possible distress over Obama not getting abortion with the new insurance plan. Perhaps she’s simply lying, or perhaps she knows, like many were saying when the President signed his “directive” about not paying for abortions, that abortions WILL be paid for under the new plan, just as contraceptives will be even with Friday’s “compromise”.  Dave

[48] Posted by DavidSh on 2-14-2012 at 12:36 AM · [top]

FrVan, You must not have read Ragsdale’s intentionally inflammatory “Abortion is a Blessing” speech if you think she was ambushed by questions on abortion.
Katherine Ragsdale would have to be incredibly naive to think that she would not be questioned about her famous “Abortion is a blessing” speech.

[49] Posted by Betty See on 2-14-2012 at 01:36 AM · [top]

“Christ” is GOD, and I don’t presume to speak for Him—particularly when it comes to issues about the judgement of their hearts. It is a strange and fallen world that would hold people in one place for the sake of idolizing hatred. We allow change and repentance when it suits purposes. We talk of the unborn and our love for them, and treat the born, our neighbor, rather badly. We mourn and show love to dead, unborn, babies but we hate the living…Geee? Wonder what Jesus would say?

[50] Posted by FrVan on 2-14-2012 at 06:23 AM · [top]

Hi Fr. Van,

” I think you should not be surprised that in a discussion of “contraception,” that I think she did well not to be ambushed into a discussion of something other. The discussion at hand was not about anything more, no matter how the field was baited, then a woman’s right to seek medical care…”

I am still surprised. Contraceptives are not health care necessities except in certain narrow circumstances in which doctors prescribe them for women for purposes other than birth control.

But what you seem to be unaware of is that the use of the term contraceptives in this debate is rather deceptive. Under that term a wide range of abortifients are also included.

So we “are” talking about requiring Christians to fund the killing of babies. And Dean Ragsdale does think the killing of a baby is like unto the healing of a heart.

She’s a sick puppy. This interview sent chills up my spine. I do pray for her repentance but I also pray that if she will not repent that her influence and power will be taken away.

[51] Posted by Matt Kennedy on 2-14-2012 at 06:31 AM · [top]

I understand, Fr. Matt, I do, thanks. Understand though, you probably know her, I don’t think I have ever met her, and you certainly know more about her than I. I might suggest that just because she gave a good presentation of herself, does not mean she won any points with anyone, it is only to say she did not drive the truck into the wall. which, for us Episcopalians is good lately. To over respond, and build a week around her, well, that gives her standing she didn’t have. she survived Fox, and conservatives hate her for it—progressives will now consider her a darling and point to StandFirm, et.al… I’ll bet if this had been a couple of weeks earlier, she would be running for bishop in Atlanta…For the greater number of folks watching the show, she came off well—helping the President.

[52] Posted by FrVan on 2-14-2012 at 07:07 AM · [top]

RE: “If you wanted me to have been influenced about the interview, to have her properly vilified, and folks like me to stand in lock-step, maybe you should have added the interview AFTER the Love-Fest week of Ragsdale’s greatest hits….”

Now see—I understood, in my own loving way, that you have not kept up with StandFirm properly!!!  ; > )

So—I recognize that there may be one or two others out there who did not Do Their Christian Duty and read StandFirm conscientiously each and every day.

So I am just issuing some kindly reminders for those reprobate souls who may have fallen into sin and error and demonstrated their Total Depravity in neglect of their duty.

Of course . . . I will be hated and loathed by the end of the week by the rest of the SF community who has already read these little jewels of Ragsdale activities and rhetoric.  But I am willing to soldier on despite the slings and arrows of cruel SF commenters who *did* actually do their duty and read SF religiously every single day and kept up with all the key players of current TEC leaders and apparatchiks.

See—we must all suffer for the few—“the many for the few” is my motto!

RE: “I think you should not be surprised that in a discussion of “contraception,” that I think she did well not to be ambushed into a discussion of something other. . . . “

Except that Ragsdale and others well know that a discussion of “contraception” is also a discussion of abortifacients, though of course they’d rather that distinction be blurred into the word “contraception.”  Heck, they’d rather the word “abortion” be eliminated as well and blurred into the word “contraception” too!

RE: “To over respond, and build a week around her, well, that gives her standing she didn’t have.”

Nah—it merely serves to educate others as to who and what she is.  I think that a good solid week will let a few more people know just what an utter disgrace to the cloth she is.  Her beliefs are repellent—I have the same vision of her as I would of Josef Mengele.

RE: ” . . . she survived Fox, and conservatives hate her for it . . . “

Now there [and only there] you’re just being silly.  I don’t hate her at all, though I am repelled by her beliefs, values, and foundational worldview.  I have no concern or thought about her in connection with Fox—though I am generally pleased that around the blogosphere most men and women of knowledge and conscience are repulsed by her and those who have less knowledge have been educated over the past week.  We’ll do our little part this week as well.

RE: ” . . . progressives will now consider her a darling . . . “

Oh they already did that.  She’s one of their heroes and has been for years.  Which just goes to show what a deep and broad and permanent chasm there is between their values and foundational worldview and those of Christendom.

[53] Posted by Sarah on 2-14-2012 at 10:41 AM · [top]

Thanks, Sarah. Your excellent, articulate response saved me the time of trouble of attempting a comment, and you said it better than I would have!

[54] Posted by Nellie on 2-14-2012 at 11:23 AM · [top]

I think the reason that Ragsdale didn’t come out over the top is that she realizes the future is for chemical abortions. Going to the Planned Murder clinic to have the aspiration method done won’t occur nearly so often because women will chemically induce an abortion. And it will be covered under ObamaCare. If we let this thing happen, our future is bleak indeed.

[55] Posted by via orthodoxy on 2-14-2012 at 11:28 AM · [top]

Speaking on behalf of the many who will have to suffer through a week of Katherine Ragsdale so that the few who seem to be unaware that EDS has functionally become a school for heresy, it might be edifying to publish a few statements and sermons by current and former Deans of Nashotah and Trinity.  If self identified orthodox rectors in TEC are not aware of the rather stark contrast between the teaching of the majority of TEC seminaries and the teaching of Nashotah and Trinity, and the stances of their administrations, one can hardly expect vestries who choose rectors to be aware of the differences.
Having such alternative readings available would also have a calming effect on those of us who would only like to hear one thing from Ragsdale- and that would be her resignation as a presbyter and seminary dean.

[56] Posted by tjmcmahon on 2-14-2012 at 11:33 AM · [top]

Excellent idea, TJ! Ater all this Ragsdale nonsense please give us some real Christian world view STAT! Lent starts soon. Our parish is having a weekly series during Lent titled:Creed or Chaos?  That could be a good starting place- a series of expositions on the Creed and its place today.

[57] Posted by SC blu cat lady on 2-14-2012 at 11:50 AM · [top]

RE: “Having such alternative readings available would also have a calming effect . . . “

To live is to suffer.

There will be no calming or peaceful antidotes to our special Katherine Ragsdale Week at StandFirm. 

The innocent must suffer with the wicked.

Unrelenting streams of Katherine Ragsdale have already been scheduled for the week.  My attempt to re-name StandFirm for the week as The Katherine Ragsdale Apostasy Blog was rebuffed by Greg but he has heartily endorsed our Week of Suffering.

The two Calvinists are definitely on board with a week of suffering—“life on earth is the Reformed Purgatory” I heard one of them mutter.  Certainly I am as well—my reading of the life of Roman soldiers in the field has inspired me.  Greg is.  I have yet to hear back from Jackie, but I’m confident that she is hardened and disciplined enough to be gung-ho.  I even polled the Commenatrix who has been off practicing sword work under some weird foreign swami, and she emailed back “How about a full year of Katherine Ragsdale Week??!!”

[58] Posted by Sarah on 2-14-2012 at 01:11 PM · [top]

Dear “Our Lady of perpetual Suffering,” or, Slow news drives the day…or better yet, Dear Sarah,

I am writing for a two-fold reason. One, to inform you that my email was hacked by a Jaded Buddhist with Mad Cow disease. Apparently addicted to Fox News Opines, feeling Laura Ingraham had jilted him in another life, and falling under the influence of a Wiccan spell, he sent out emails extolling some apparent Democrat (which, in that I have never voted other than Republican, my security panel was alerted, which informed me of what happened). Also the White House is alerted every time I say anything about the president, so another alert was sounded. But, now that I am out of prison I am writing to inform you of any emails you might have gotten that would have anything to do with aforesaid subject… Secondly, I see you are having a week of someone name “Ragsale”—facinating stuff. Can’t imagine your obsession with her. But having said that, I am letting you know that I will be attending a retreat held by the Brothers of Religious Discipline, Fox, Opine, where I intend to read religiously only Standfirm Texts. I am taking with me an Icon of Our Lady of rags in the Dale, sent by Matt. I am concerned about how I will get all the burning crosses in the car with me. But Thanks for everything—thought I’d check in…

[59] Posted by FrVan on 2-14-2012 at 03:11 PM · [top]

On the ENS website, there are a few people doing theological battle with Kaeton.  I gotta give them some props for doing so.  Although I notice when it gets a little hot, she sort just dismisses those that disagree with her.  These people live in an insular world, and I like the fact that some men and women are over there giving it back to her.  She really can’t seem to take too much disagreement, before she just kind of shuts down the debate.

[60] Posted by Looking for Leaders on 2-14-2012 at 04:04 PM · [top]

I just have this to say to Ms Ragsdale:  Hey, lady, if you can’t stand the heat, get outta the kitchen!

[61] Posted by cennydd13 on 2-14-2012 at 04:53 PM · [top]

I ♥ Sarah.

[62] Posted by paradoxymoron on 2-14-2012 at 07:16 PM · [top]

So can someone provide any insight as to the current fortunes of EDS?  How many thousands are flocking to those hallowed halls?

[63] Posted by Nikolaus on 2-14-2012 at 10:28 PM · [top]

Registered members are welcome to leave comments. Log in here, or register here.

Comment Policy: We pride ourselves on having some of the most open, honest debate anywhere. However, we do have a few rules that we enforce strictly. They are: No over-the-top profanity, no racial or ethnic slurs, and no threats real or implied of physical violence. Please see this post for more explanation, and the posts here, here, and here for advice on becoming a valued commenter as opposed to an ex-commenter. Although we rarely do so, we reserve the right to remove or edit comments, as well as suspend users' accounts, solely at the discretion of site administrators. Since we try to err on the side of open debate, you may sometimes see comments which you believe strain the boundaries of our rules. Comments are the opinions of visitors, and do not necessarily reflect the opinion of Stand Firm site administrators or Gri5th Media, LLC.