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Wonder of Wonders - Martyn Minns Can Type

Thursday, August 23, 2007 • 9:43 pm


Lots of breathless chatter and furrowed-brow tsk-tsk-ing by revisionists of the revelation that the original digital file containing the statement from the Anglican Church of Nigeria titled “A Most Agonizing Journey towards Lambeth 2008” appears to have been edited heavily by Bishop Martyn Minns.

At Episcopal Cafe, Jim Naughton writes:

The significance of this development lies less in the fact that Akinola has a ghostwriter—The leaders of many organizations, ecclesial and secular have staff members who handle writing assignments for them.—than that what has long been portrayed as the authentic voice of African Anglicanism is, manifestly, not African, and perhaps never has been.

Jake writes:

What is the significance of this? A document that is purported to be an expression of the “personal anguish” of an African Primate was actually penned by this Primate’s North Atlantic allies. Any claim that it is an expression of the mind of the Global South can no longer be considered valid.

If I were a Global South clergy person, I would be quite concerned, if not deeply offended, by North Americans and Europeans having the audacity to think they can speak for the Global South.

In lieu of paper bags into which these two gentlemen may breathe, may I offer the following:

- Any accusation that Minns’ helping to author the statement is evidence that “what has long been portrayed as the authentic voice of African Anglicanism is, manifestly, not African, and perhaps never has been,” is just childish and silly. Martyn Minns is a bishop in the Anglican Church of Nigeria. He is the Assistant Secretary for the Global South Steering Committee, for crying out loud. Helping write statements such as “Agonizing Journey” is part of his job. He has been close to the leaders in that province for years. He is in fact quite familiar with the prevailing thought of the province, and is quite well-suited to speak for it. Saying Minns isn’t a knowledgeable spokesman for Nigeria is like saying Naughton isn’t a knowledgeable spokesman for the Diocese of Washington, or Susan Russell isn’t a knowledgeable spokeswoman for the Diocese of Los Angeles.

- Archbishop Akinola was in Virginia last week, when the statement was released. He and Minns spent much time together. It is entirely possible that +Akinola was using Minns’ computer to compose his statement. It is more likely that +Akinola was dictating the statement to Minns. It is far more likely that +Akinola was giving shape and form to the statement, while relying on Minns for the exact wording… in other words, exactly what a trusted confidant and Assistant Secretary of the Global South Steering Committee is for. Surely Jim Naughton, as a diocesan communications director who has no doubt ghost-written more than a few of John Chane’s statements, understands how that works.

- Any notion - asserted both by Jake and Naughton - that Martyn Minns “pulled one over” on Archbishop Akinola is absurd. There is simply no way the Anglican Church of Nigeria released a statement that was not approved by +Akinola.

- The idea - also asserted both by Jake and Naughton - that Peter Akinola doesn’t possess the intellectual acumen or the command of the English language to compose “Agonizing Journey,” is equally absurd, and tinged with more than a touch of racism. The archbishop is a highly educated man (master’s degree from Virginia Theological Seminary) and is quite articulate.

The Church Times story obviously springs from someone’s having obtained the original word-processing file containing the statement. Both Microsoft Word and WordPerfect have change-tracking features; I believe both are set to “on” by default during installation.So while it might be interesting to learn exactly how this file got into the hands of the Church Times reporter, that will almost certainly prove to be by far the most interesting part of this “story.”


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Comments:

As a computer professional I would agree with you completely Greg.

The first line of the article is:
A BISHOP in the United States has been revealed as the principal author of a seminal letter to the Church of Nigeria from its Archbishop, the Most Revd Peter Akinola, which was published on Sunday.

Despite a lot of backtracking later with the use of “seem”, etc. later I would still have to say this is a most disingenuous opening line. The tracking reveals nothing except the name of the user logged into the computer when the typing was done. It in no way proves Akinola did not type it himself or dictate it. It also is no surprise that Akinola would be in consultation with one of his Bishops while preparing am important statement.

One can only imagine the tracking records that might show up on the files of the ABC or KJS!

[1] Posted by Rocks on 08-23-2007 at 10:39 PM • top

And I love this, from Jake:

If I were a Global South clergy person, I would be quite concerned, if not deeply offended, by North Americans and Europeans having the audacity to think they can speak for the Global South.

This from the ‘chicken dinners’ crowd!

[2] Posted by Greg Griffith on 08-23-2007 at 10:44 PM • top

Oh no, it was a collaborative document? Heavens, I never thought someone of ++Akinola stature ever needed a proof-reader (nevermind “he who proof reads himself has a fool for an editor”) much less might use a trusted source.

I guess now the gig is up. I should confess to writing many a letter for my boss, I know he signed them as president of our company, but I was tasked to write them. I’ve heard very vicious rumors that President Bush has speech writer who actually craft much of the substance of what he going to say as well.

I guess the sky is falling, what is the world coming to? (Well, my boss is the one whose signature is on the letter to the State Corporation Commission, so I guess I’m off the hook ... right smile )

[3] Posted by Hosea6:6 on 08-23-2007 at 10:47 PM • top

I cannot fathom all the fuss over this.  The whole thing seems absurd, except for the fact that it borders on the racist at points.  This last observation I find deeply offensive, most un-Christian, and quite disturbing.  Naughton’s statement that: “what has long been portrayed as the authentic voice of African Anglicanism is, manifestly, not African, and perhaps never has been” strikes me as plainly racist.  Is he suggesting that Archbishop Akinola doesn’t have these thoughts on his own, or is incapable of expressing them?  What, exactly, is Naughton’s point?  If Akinola put his name to it, it’s his letter—or is Naughton suggesting that Archbishop Akinola doesn’t even understand the letters he signs?  Does the Primate of TEC write EVERY word of her own letters?  Are they any less her letters because someone else collaborated in writing them?  There really is a disturbing racist assumption, I think, behind Naughton’s statement.  Are we to understand that if the Archbishop of Abuja seeks the advise of white English-born bishops of his church that the authenticity of his own voice is somehow nullified?  Wow, if this is the level to which we have sunk, it’s hard to see any hope.

[4] Posted by Chris Taylor on 08-23-2007 at 10:50 PM • top

Is it possible that Akinola revised it on Martyn Minns typewriter? Aren’t all speeches proofread by a second person and revised before they are presented? Why should this be shocking?

[5] Posted by Betty See on 08-23-2007 at 11:02 PM • top

Copious tears streaming down my cheeks, I’m laughing so hard!
It’s all so hilarious…it’s nearly sad. If it weren’t for the hubris involved, I’d be moved to pity.

[6] Posted by PadreWayne on 08-23-2007 at 11:05 PM • top

Should we draw the conclusion from this, that revisionists don’t proofread, revue or revise their speeches?

[7] Posted by Betty See on 08-23-2007 at 11:17 PM • top

oops, that should have been review not revue, that is what happens when you don’t proofread or review your article with another person.

[8] Posted by Betty See on 08-23-2007 at 11:23 PM • top

Wow…I was Banned by Jake™ for responding to him with this:

“He is being played, quite clearly.”

Really??? What is so clear about it?
Or is it just supposed to be obvious, as you seem to suggest, that Akinola is too stupid to understand the letter?
What is in this letter, exactly, which could not have been Akinola’s idea? More importantly, why do you think Akinola is incapable of writing it?
After all I’m sure he can come up with as many honorary degrees as Louie Crew does.
Rocks | 08.24.07 - 12:20 am | #

[9] Posted by Rocks on 08-23-2007 at 11:35 PM • top

This kinda reminds me of the phony documents about President George W. Bush service record in the National Guard that led to the humiliating departure of Dan Rather.

Is this payback from the militant moonbats on the Piskie Left?

[10] Posted by Truth Unites... and Divides on 08-23-2007 at 11:48 PM • top

Does this mean Archbishop Akinola isn’t in anguish?

[11] Posted by DietofWorms on 08-23-2007 at 11:50 PM • top

This from the ‘chicken dinners’ crowd!

Ah now I think I can see what Jake is getting at!
Minns served barbecue chicken to insure that Akinola would not be able to type. Giving him the opportunity to type his thoughts into the letter.
Akinola being in a hurry to clean his hands after eating simply glanced at the letter and Minns sent it off. The perfect gambit.
From Lambeth to now the “chicken dinner” ploy keeps paying off.

[12] Posted by Rocks on 08-23-2007 at 11:58 PM • top

“Pay No Attention to the Bishop Behind the Curtain!”

[13] Posted by PatrickB on 08-24-2007 at 12:33 AM • top

As I wrote elsewhere, let’s just agree to call the authors A, M and S. They may be one and the same. That’s what textual criticism is all about.

[14] Posted by John B. Chilton on 08-24-2007 at 01:21 AM • top

I don’t know what Jake and ARRRRRGH Jim lad are hyperventilating about.  Letting other people write your opinion is a fine old Anglican tradition:

http://mcj.bloghorn.com/3157

Even in Canada:

http://mcj.bloghorn.com/918

Frank Griswold was into recycling:

http://mcj.bloghorn.com/621

At least twice:

http://mcj.bloghorn.com/944

[15] Posted by Christopher Johnson on 08-24-2007 at 01:23 AM • top

Padre Wayne, whose hubris do you mean?

[16] Posted by Milton on 08-24-2007 at 01:42 AM • top

Thanks Greg for injecting some sanity & reason into this fuss!  You’ve said it all so brilliantly there’s nothing I can add grin

[17] Posted by Karen B. on 08-24-2007 at 05:16 AM • top

Collaboration by colleagues doesn’t bother me.
In Dar es Salaam, the sub-group report was released by the joint primates-Anglican Consultative Council standing committee, a committee chaired by Archbishop Rowan Williams.  After the release of this document, it was reported that Archbishop Malango’s name had been affixed to the sub-group report even though he had not seen it.  Signing someone’s name to a document without their permission does bother me.

[18] Posted by Jill Woodliff on 08-24-2007 at 06:55 AM • top

Jake and Naughton seem most unwilling to pass up an opportunity to insult global south clergy, regardless of how ridiculous it makes them (Jake and Naughton) appear:

If I were a Global South clergy person, I would be quite concerned, if not deeply offended, by North Americans and Europeans having the audacity to think they can speak for the Global South.

LOL.  Does Jake really believe this stuff? I can’t imagine any clergy being so bent, dim, and mistrustful of their own leadership as to come to the same conclusion.  What a waste of hard drive!

[19] Posted by tired on 08-24-2007 at 07:25 AM • top

If Brother +Akinola signs it, he is confirming them as his words.  That’s the way ghostwriting works.

[20] Posted by Zoomdaddy on 08-24-2007 at 07:54 AM • top

This is the non-story of the year, taking first place from the ones about the Pope being Catholic.  At first, I thought this was one of Greg’s parodies, but, no: this is for real.  More proof that the Left is completely out of touch with the real world.

Interestingly, this scandal was developing further last night in, of all places, the secular media.  It can now be revealed that Matthew Scully has signed up with Fred Thompson’s nascent campaign.  This character Scully apparently was a – wait for it – SPEECHWRITER for President Bush.  No, you read that right.  And he’s going to do the same thing for Fred Thompson – it’s right there on the Washington Post’s site!  The brazenness of these conservatives!

He wrote speeches for President Bush that Bush then stood up and delivered like he had written them himself!

Can I ask: how many people here think that when a press release says, “CEO Johnson said this,” or, “President Davis said that,” that Johnson and Davis really said those things, as opposed to some marcom staffer?  No hands?  Smart crowd.

And, has anybody here ever created a presentation that your boss went on to deliver and take the glory for?  Hmm.  Lots of hands.

In case any Jake commenter wanders over here, I’d like to make one thing clear: I’m deeply disturbed over the direction of the Episcopal Church.  Lots of people are.  I felt that way before there was a Network, and I’ll think that way after it’s gone.  You can produce checks to David Anderson, Bob Duncan and Jack Iker signed by Nelson Rockefeller and the Trilateral Commission themselves, and it won’t affect how I feel about what you’re doing to the church of my birth.  You can sue, threaten and play gotcha all you like, but you can’t stop me and a lot of other people from continuing to stream out the door.  I’m sorry you choose to play games instead of solving the real problems you’ve created.  Keep in mind there’s an old, culturally-conditioned book of myths somewhere that says, “Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap.”

[21] Posted by Phil on 08-24-2007 at 07:59 AM • top

that will almost certainly prove to be by far the most interesting part of this “story.”

Yes, I’d like to hear how the Church Times got the file. And don’t you wonder at the suspicious mind that checked the tracking? I get the feeling that for some of these people, the evolutionary line is hypothesized as: monkey, black man, white man. They are so desperate to believe that Akinola isn’t really who he is, but is somehow, a puppet for a white man. Maybe, because that’s how they would use him? They prefer black men they can patronize?

[22] Posted by oscewicee on 08-24-2007 at 08:05 AM • top

I’d like to make one thing clear: I’m deeply disturbed over the direction of the Episcopal Church.  Lots of people are.  I felt that way before there was a Network, and I’ll think that way after it’s gone.  You can produce checks to David Anderson, Bob Duncan and Jack Iker signed by Nelson Rockefeller and the Trilateral Commission themselves, and it won’t affect how I feel about what you’re doing to the church of my birth.

Well said, Phil. I suppose the corollary to believing that Akinola is a sock puppet for an American bishop is to believe that the ACN etc. is just stirring up trouble and that there aren’t really any Episcopalians who are deeply disturbed by what the “leaders” of their church are doing. After all, KJS keeps telling us there’s not really a problem, so it must be true….

[23] Posted by oscewicee on 08-24-2007 at 08:17 AM • top

This is the non-story of the year, taking first place from the ones about the Pope being Catholic.

Hee.

I don’t know it’s a pretty close toss-up. (Thanks for the smile you brought to my face.)

[24] Posted by Hosea6:6 on 08-24-2007 at 08:20 AM • top

Uh-oh.  There is an actual Trilateral Commission.  It has actual members.  And I believe one of them has written a check to support the Network.  So we could be in trouble.

[25] Posted by pendennis88 on 08-24-2007 at 08:24 AM • top

Oh, boy, pendennis - I should have known!

[26] Posted by Phil on 08-24-2007 at 08:31 AM • top

Well, the Anglican Cat is out of the bag now!

Jake & Jim: 

I will confess, that I am not the authentic voice of myself, either.  Sigh - I ALWAYS let my husband proof my writing before publishing it…  I have always done this because he’s a different writer than myself, finds syntax errors, and is much more concise than myself.

Now I understand that this is the PROOF that I am not an authentic voice for anything I write… even if it is incomprehensible because I didn’t edit it…

OH THE INHUMANITY!  I repent!

This really is the dumbest attempt at trying to belittle a Primate I’ve seen in the nearly 4 years on the net… as intelligent people I would expect a little more demonstration of that adjective.

[27] Posted by Eclipse on 08-24-2007 at 09:15 AM • top

I think we should all confess. Greg Griffith wrote all the posts above and this one, using pseudonyms.

[28] Posted by oscewicee on 08-24-2007 at 09:30 AM • top

oscewicee,
LOL.  I thought you were going to say Greg wrote and posted EVERYTHING at StandFirm and that Sarah, Matt+, Jackie and David O. don’t really exist at all wink

[29] Posted by Karen B. on 08-24-2007 at 09:37 AM • top

All of the defensive posturing and “this is not a big deal” grandstanding is making reasserters look overly nervous.

If Akinola did, in fact, colloborate with Minns while in VA he should say so and let people decide on their own whether to believe him or not.  What is shown is that Minns or Minns’ computer certainly had a hand in it.  So certainly there are going to be those who will claim that Minns wrote it for Akinola, even if it was with Akinola’s blessing and knowledge.  Their credibility has taken a hit and damage control forces are working to make this look like not a big deal even if it isn’t a big deal at all.

But I bet he won’t make that same mistake twice.

[30] Posted by Vintner on 08-24-2007 at 09:37 AM • top

Smuggs :

Yes, so conclusive of evidence is startling.  I am writing on my husband’s computer at present, so I MUST be him.  Or he’s me or we are they are us are them…

So, does that make me the non-authentic voice of myself or the authentic voice of my husband?  Or am I the kinda authentic voice of the cat of whom I’ve attached my name?

Now I’m very confused… ah, yes… smacks of “The Episcopal Church Welcomes YOU!”

[31] Posted by Eclipse on 08-24-2007 at 09:41 AM • top

Folks,
I think we are missing a great opportunity here.  Let’s get hold of this tracking software, and find out how many post HoB pastoral statements were written by Jim Naughton.  Why, we could discover whether the invitation letters to Lambeth were personally written, every word, by +Rowan himself.  Wouldn’t it be a scandal if Canon Kearon helped?  Or +Rowan’s personal secretary, or if he actually uses a spell checker?

And lets find out if Jim Naughton indeed “ghost wrote” the Church Times story he is quoting.

And if you are +Bob Duncan, or +Martin Minns, or +Rowan Williams, download AVG or some other good antivirus, and some antitracking software, clear out all your TEC related “tracking cookies” and to top it off, translate everything you send out as a press release into plain text and back again, and email it back and forth a couple times in plain text (ie:turn off the html) before sending it to the church times or posting it on your website.  Because the one thing this story proves is that the revisionists are out to get you, and are willing to use very sophisticated methods to do it. 

You know what this means? Right now, Jim Naughton and his cronies are running this post through their spy software to determine how much of this was really written by tjmcmahon and how much by +Martin Minns.  Just think of the time they are wasting trying to track every laptop at Georgetown to find the one in the hands of +Rowan Williams.

[32] Posted by tjmcmahon on 08-24-2007 at 09:43 AM • top

You’re posturing defensively again….let it go and let people decide for themselves.

[33] Posted by Vintner on 08-24-2007 at 09:44 AM • top

Smuggs, not only has Akinola’s credibility not take a hit, I’m sure he’ll work with Minns on future letters - again, and again, and again, because that’s what aides do.

Ever heard of Michael Waldman?  He was a one-time chief speechwriter for President Clinton.  Should Clinton have told us that before every speech, so “people [could] decide on their own whether to believe [Clinton] or not?”  That’s not a disclaimer I ever heard, but why don’t you get on Lexis-Nexis and get back to us?

[34] Posted by Phil on 08-24-2007 at 09:47 AM • top

Sarcasm does not become you, Phil.  Speech writers are hired and we know that.  I wasn’t aware that Minns was hired to be a speech writer.

I don’t care if he wrote it, if Akinola and he wrote it together, or if Akinola wrote it all by himself.  Akinola’s credibility has taken a hit and that’s why you are reacting the way you are.

Now I, for one, am leaving this be, am going out to enjoy the day, and will return later to see if Akinola will speak for himself on the issue.

[35] Posted by Vintner on 08-24-2007 at 09:52 AM • top

thought you were going to say Greg wrote and posted EVERYTHING at StandFirm and that Sarah, Matt+, Jackie and David O. don’t really exist at all

Psst!! Shhh, Karen. We’re not ready to let that Cat out of the bag yet. That comes right before we reveal that the ACN is Greg.

[36] Posted by oscewicee on 08-24-2007 at 09:52 AM • top

I think you might be misunderstanding mocking and irony as ‘posturing defensively’ Smuggs

[37] Posted by Peter on 08-24-2007 at 09:52 AM • top

Smuggs—as politely as I know how & dripping with love, all I know to say in response to your posts is, “please, get a life.”

[38] Posted by Hosea6:6 on 08-24-2007 at 09:53 AM • top

I speak Portuguese fluently, but when I write I still have a native speaker proof my work.  Writing a foreign language is a completely different animal from speaking it.  This is an utterly manufactured controversy.

[39] Posted by Jeffersonian on 08-24-2007 at 09:55 AM • top

Do you think Mr Naughton could use his software and settle once and for all the controversy over the authorship of the later Pauline letters?

[40] Posted by tjmcmahon on 08-24-2007 at 09:55 AM • top

All of the defensive posturing and “this is not a big deal” grandstanding is making reasserters look overly nervous.

Don’t you wish. grin You don’t make it clear which “he” has supposedly “learned a lesson,” but I would guess that both men have learned that someone they trusted is untrustworthy. And that’s about it for this Hot News.

[41] Posted by oscewicee on 08-24-2007 at 09:56 AM • top

Smuggs - but who cares if you’re aware of what Minns was hired to do?  I’m not aware, either.  There are probably twenty things in his job description I don’t know.  So what?  What does you’re awareness have to do with anything?

Here’s another one: over the weekend, we lost one of President Reagan’s old hands, Mike Deaver.  One of the stories told in the papers was how Deaver advised Reagan to fire chief of staff Donald Regan in the wake of Iran-Contra (Reagan resisted).  But, Deaver was, essentially, Reagan’s publicist.  Of course, he was also an old friend, going back to the California governor days.

Are you outraged that Deaver would dare stray outside his job to offer his old friend advice?

Get real, Smuggs.  Even Fr. Jake is downplaying this story now.  Read his comment thread.

[42] Posted by Phil on 08-24-2007 at 09:58 AM • top

TJM, maybe he could go on from there and settle that pesky question of who really wrote Shakespeare. Wait! Could +Minns have had a hand in that too??

[43] Posted by oscewicee on 08-24-2007 at 10:00 AM • top

Smuggs:  I am assured through statistical analysis of word patterns and syntax that Sarah Hey is actually the author of all the posts attributed to Greg and Matt.  She is secretly using proxy servers to take control of their computers and post to this blog.  She has been very clever in her seeming to disagree with Matt in several posts, but I have it on good authority that most of these posts come from her very own Apple iBook.  We (my fellow analysts and I) only had time to analyze the posts attributed to Matt and Greg.  Who knows how many others she may have (ghost)written?  Of course, that begs the question of when does she sleep, but that’s a minor consideration. ;=)

[44] Posted by Charles III on 08-24-2007 at 10:01 AM • top

RE: “You’re posturing defensively again . . . “

Do you think you might be mistaking “defensive” for “having a good time on a Friday morning?”  ; > )

Come come, Smuggs . . . surely if we none of us noticed the story, you’d be chirping about how there is an “eery and embarrassed silence over at the reasserting blogs” . . .

; > )

Truth is . . . we just ain’t sad over the things you’re sad over.  Ain’t happy over the things you’re happy over.  Ain’t scared over the things you’re scared over.  Ain’t ashamed of the things you’re ashamed over.  Ain’t defensive over the things you’re defensive over . . . and on and on it goes.

This is understandable.

We don’t share the same foundational worldviews, and thus most things that we like you don’t, and vice versa.

[45] Posted by Sarah on 08-24-2007 at 10:10 AM • top

Actually Smuggs, all of the comments here, except yours, are generated by IRD supplied commentary software that runs on big servers hidden under Roslyn chapel.  Sarah dials in for every story, and sets a “critique level” and a “humor level” and how many posts she wants included from the “Tighe Anglo Historical database” that runs on the NORAD computers in Colorado Springs.

Roslynchapel/IRD/standfirmcommentary/article/5271/#98189/com3/tjmcmahon//NORADIDcheck/hey/confirmed

If that shows up in highlight blue as a link, it will be really scary.

[46] Posted by tjmcmahon on 08-24-2007 at 10:14 AM • top

As Greg concludes:

The Church Times story obviously springs from someone’s having obtained the original word-processing file containing the statement. Both Microsoft Word and WordPerfect have change-tracking features; I believe both are set to “on” by default during installation.So while it might be interesting to learn exactly how this file got into the hands of the Church Times reporter, that will almost certainly prove to be by far the most interesting part of this “story.”

That Christian leaders who share a vision work together to craft an important statement is a good thing.
That Christians are engaging in covert spying operations and engaging in some sort of hi tech theft techniques is disturbing.
That the reporter for the Church Times would accept this material and not see the behavior required to obtain it as the Real Story is another indication of the rampant corruption we face.

[47] Posted by Deja Vu on 08-24-2007 at 10:17 AM • top

I guess we don’t need a Fri. Afternoon Palate cleanser today!  This thread is filling that role very nicely.  I haven’t laughed so hard in quite awhile wink

[48] Posted by Karen B. on 08-24-2007 at 10:17 AM • top

Smuggs :

There are two major points here:

1.  This is such a stupid ‘news article’ most of us are just having a great deal of fun trashing it:  Let me be precise: “it is poorly written, it is not well-planned, it is a pathetic attempt at dis-creditation, it is over-wrought and under-thought, it is not worth the Internet space it occupies, it IS a ‘loss for words’, the word ‘credibility’ will not darken its door way, it makes a mockery of the term ‘newsworthy’, it IS, SIR, an X-news item!”

2. I am at present writing on my husband’s computer.  Using the faculty logic of this piece: I am then, my husband, or my husband is really writing this, or I am too stupid to write this in the first place so my husband had to write it for me.

Since that is simply ridiculous, so hence is the premise…

[49] Posted by Eclipse on 08-24-2007 at 10:18 AM • top

Agree with Kendall and others who have had bosses breathing down your neck to revise things…even lawyers…yuck (sorry, Brad Drell).  I’ve written letters for the boss and told by the boss to even sign them for the boss. 

This shows the desparation of Jake and Naughton.  Bonned by Jake?  Over that!!! Heh.Heh.Heh.

Padre Wayne - thought you weren’t coming here any more.  Still would like an answer to my question.

[50] Posted by The Lakeland Two on 08-24-2007 at 10:21 AM • top

Oops!  Bonned by Jake - typo - Banned. EVERY writer needs an editor.

[51] Posted by The Lakeland Two on 08-24-2007 at 10:24 AM • top

over-wrought and under-thought

Eclipse that is it in a nicely worded nutshell.

[52] Posted by oscewicee on 08-24-2007 at 10:25 AM • top

Eclipse writes:

Yes, so conclusive of evidence is startling.  I am writing on my husband’s computer at present, so I MUST be him.  Or he’s me or we are they are us are them…

I am laughing so hard. If someone used these techniques with the computer I use, they would think all my comments are from a 16 year old girl who is obsessed with Anime, Manga and Kingdom Hearts.

[53] Posted by Deja Vu on 08-24-2007 at 10:25 AM • top

The left is very good at turning picayune matters into conflaguratins ie the Valerie Plame incident - largely because of better media access and contacts - conservatives rarely become newsmen.  Its August - most folks are still on vacation.  Slow news day.  As an attorney and one who is/was politically active I have gostwritten letters and heavily edited them (in fact I just finished dictating a letter for my assistant to type and my client to sign) - in the end as long as it accurately reflects the views/statements/sentiments of the person who signs the letter there is no story.  The way to avoid a computer annalysis of your work is to send yourself a PDF copy of your letter from your copy machine - then email it out - never send anything controversial in a word format.  Really folks if we are going to fight an evil empire - we need really first rate consultants, media flacks, and law firms.

[54] Posted by chips on 08-24-2007 at 10:28 AM • top

Oh my!  I hadn’t actually logged into the church times online since I’d first seen the text of their story by e-mail.  Thus I hadn’t seen the picture of Martyn they’ve published.

Oh, so funny.  I wonder how long it took them to find that gem to make him look as scheming and evil as possible?!?!  Just loving it.

It’s a wonder they didn’t photoshop it a bit to make his ears pointy or lengthen the front teeth a bit!  Tears rolling down my cheeks I’m laughing so hard.  This is really just priceless stuff.

[55] Posted by Karen B. on 08-24-2007 at 10:38 AM • top

Chips wrote: 

Really folks if we are going to fight an evil empire - we need really first rate consultants, media flacks, and law firms. 

Did we see those in the first three episodes (IV, V, VI) of Star Wars?  wink

Serously, Chips is right.  100%.  And until we realize this, we are just playing catch-up.

[56] Posted by The Lakeland Two on 08-24-2007 at 10:40 AM • top

As far as how the Church Times got the file for all we know this was sent out in DOC format to the press to begin with. After all, despite the wailing and gnashing of teeth, there is nothing sinister about this so why hide it?

FYI- I hope the powers that be don’t mind me posting this, I have nothing to do with the software.
If you are going to send things out you should do them as a PDF.
There is a nice bit of free software to do this called Primopdf at http://www.primopdf.com/. It’s free and has no adware or anything attached. After you install it you have another printer and when you choose it from any application it creates a pdf of what was sent to it.
Say goodbye to info stored with the file. This is especially nice to use for pictures. Picture files have a lot of info on them.
Virtually everyone has Acrobat Reader or can get it for free easily so using PDF insures most anyone can view the file or picture.

[57] Posted by Rocks on 08-24-2007 at 10:49 AM • top

As one who has had a 45+ year career in Public Relations, I cannot count the number of times I have written (ghost-written) statements and speeches for CEOs and senior executives, some of which those individuals never saw until they got on an airplane to travel to the site of the speech. In virtually every case there was consultations before the piece was put together and usually, but not always, there was a review of a first draft which was then tweaked.

Depending on the issue or circumstances, I, occasionally was told to “put something together and release it under my signature,” or “put something together and quote me as saying ‘xxxx’ then add whatever else you want.

This is a total non-issue on the part of Jake, Naughton and Smuggs and clearly speaks to the fact that, as usual, they don’t have a clue about how things happen in the real world.

Now, I would also submit that we have seen other pieces from ++Akinola which we actually don’t know whether or not they were penned by him. But, having heard the clearness with which he speaks in an interview, what appears to have been written by him speaks with the same clarity. If +Minns has the talent to capture that clarity, he is indeed gifted and demonstrates his value as an aide to +Akinola.

All I can say to Smuggs, Naughton and Jake is: “Get over it guys, you’ve made yourselves look like idiots again.”

It seems like every time you try to use the liberal trick of attempting to convert a non-issue into an issue, you shove your feets further down your throats. I’m surprised you have any toes left because they’ve been dangling so long in your own digestive fluids. :grin

[58] Posted by Forgiven on 08-24-2007 at 10:52 AM • top

Let me get this straight:

Martin Minns is a “Nigerian Bishop” leading a ‘Nigerian group’ when it suits the revisionists, but he’s a ‘North American ally’ at other times?

Does he wear a sign letting onlookers know which role he’s playing at any given time?

[59] Posted by Paul B on 08-24-2007 at 10:56 AM • top

Initially ignored the publication but for Smuggs and others, there is a press statement copied below

It is very insulting and racist to infer that the Primate of All Nigeria is being dictated to.  Is this in continuation of the ‘jamming’ of people opposing the agenda?

I would have believed the ‘computer software’ story were it not for the allegation of ‘minor amendments’ by the Canon Chris Sugden who had nothing to do with the document.

Abp. Akinola informed his senior staff and the Episcopal Secretary the need to highlight efforts at maintaining unity and the intransigence of the revisionists so that the Nigerian community is left in no doubt about who is ‘walking apart’

Along with his PA in Abuja, work started on the gathering of materials and relevant documents on 6th August, 2007.  We used in addition to existing statements and my internet searches, Nigerian Episcopal meeting documents and TECUSA resolutions supplied respectively by our Episcopal Secretary, the Rt. Rev. Friday Imaekhia and a CANA priest, the Rev. Canon David Anderson. The draft of the statement was ready for correction by the primate on 9th August, 2007 who was however unable to correct it as he was about to travel.

Abp. Akinola was in the US and Bahamas between 10th and 22nd August 2007. I sent the draft to him through the Rt. Rev Minns with a request for assistance in getting some online references which I could not easily locate. 

I fail to see any issue if amendments are then made on Bp. Minns’ computer. Apart from the fact that they were together during the period of the amendment, the Archbishop like many effective leaders who spend little time glued to a desk often phones me and other staffs to write certain things. Such remain his idea and anyone who knows Abp. Peter Akinola knows you can not make him say what he does not mean.

The publication doubting authenticity is another attempt to divert attention away from the carefully researched document which shows that the revisionists are directly responsible for problems confronting the Communion. Instead of chasing shadows, concerned Anglicans should consider the indisputable scenario highlighted in the document and pray for ways to save our beleaguered

[60] Posted by Tunde on 08-24-2007 at 11:35 AM • top

This story is amazing.  I used to do research for a guy who spent about 9 months every year on the road lecturing around the world.  He would call me up; ask for all the information I could get on X topic and give me a time frame to get it back to him, usually that night or the next day.  He then took what I wrote and presented it to whatever group he was speaking to at the time.

He even did this with his books, about 30 of them, using his staff to find information, write it up, and voila!—book chapters appeared.  My brother goes to a huge church where the pastor has a research assistant who helps put the message together every week and prepare for future messages.  Something that happens in most mega churches.

These are ancient discoveries and practice and are barely worth the bandwidth except to note the incredible disconnect with reality from the reapprasing side.

[61] Posted by Rom 1:16 on 08-24-2007 at 11:36 AM • top

It is very insulting and racist to infer that the Primate of All Nigeria is being dictated to.  Is this in continuation of the ‘jamming’ of people opposing the agenda?

Uh oh. I wish that the Venerable AkinTunde Popoola hadn’t said this. Over at Jake’s they’ll tell him he’s projecting. By which they will mean he’s a racist. Not that they’re projecting or anything.

[62] Posted by oscewicee on 08-24-2007 at 11:43 AM • top

Given the apparent magical mind-altering power of chicken dinners, I’m surprised the revisionists haven’t yet tried offering us any.

Mmm… chicken.

[63] Posted by st. anonymous on 08-24-2007 at 12:17 PM • top

The photograph of +Martyn Minns is especially interesting—is this an attempt by revisionists to duplicate the scary Guy Fawkes image recalling a Jesuit plot in England (1605)?  Of course, Guy Fawkes has always been a familiar figure of ignominy in broadside pictures, cartoons, masks, dramatic depictions, and activities of Guy Fawkes Day.  Check out the following.  All Martyn needs is a hat!  (Could there be an attempt to get subliminal sympathy for the revisionist cause by evoking the wild-eyed, secretive agents of the Pope conspiring to blow up the Houses of Parliament?  Ha-ha?)

http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/8901/theguys.html
Guy Fawkes cartoon (Cruikshank 1827)

http://www.cbc.ca/arts/film/vendetta.html
shows a Guy Fawkes mask in modern drama

http://www.angliacampus.com/public/pri/history/guyfawk/page05.htm
another pic. of Guy Fawkes

http://encarta.msn.com/media_461515564/Guy_Fawkes.html
another pic of the wily Papist

[64] Posted by Paula on 08-24-2007 at 12:36 PM • top

Via Russell’s blog, a self-avowedly “shameless” defense of liberal churches by a liberal:

Liberals refuse to let Scripture and/or tradition decide the issue in the face of reasoned experience of abuse and degradation. And it is precisely this sort of argument that liberals find telling, where issues of gender and sexuality are concerned. Taboos against homosexuals do psycho-spiritual violence to gay and lesbian persons. ‘Don’t ask/don’t tell’ represses creativity and fosters psycho-spiritual fragmentation. Church policy that uses gay and lesbian clergy while forcing closeting and all the while threatening career-breaking ‘outing’ at any time, is abusive.

Treating women as second class citizens, frustrating the expression of their gifts within the Church is likewise abusive. Demanding that women appear smaller than they are—gays and lesbians, otherwise than they are—so that others can feel as big or secure or comfortable as they feel they need to be—this is paradigm-case abusive. Liberals conclude it therefore has to stop, no matter what Scripture and tradition or any other ideology appear to say. Biblical homophobia and sexism—like child sacrifice and slavery—are easily dismissed as cultural blind-spots, unless one shares them. For faithful liberals who wrestle with God all the way through Scripture and tradition, that is the bottom line!

Whoa.  Just… whoa.  Where to begin?  The breathtaking arrogance and self-importance; the hubris; the ludicrous pop jargon (“psycho-spiritual violence,” “paradigm-case abusive”).  A word of advice to megalomaniac liberals: if you “wrestle with God”, as Jacob did, you’ll find that He is quite likely to win.

[65] Posted by st. anonymous on 08-24-2007 at 12:45 PM • top

As one of the many ghostwriters who ghostwrite for Jim Naughton’s speeches for +Chane to read in the Iranian National Cathedral in DC, I’ve been told that every single comment written on this post has been plagiarized from one or another of +KJS’s interviews.

[66] Posted by Bill C on 08-24-2007 at 12:48 PM • top

As one of the many ghostwriters who ghostwrite for Jim Naughton’s speeches…

GW:  In the past perhaps but not for now.  You are suspended from the Ghostwriters Guild for failing to pay your annual dues for 2007.  Your membership privledges have been withdrawn.  You may have your membership privileges restored by sending the delinquent assessment plus the requisite reinstatement fee to me immediately.
Professor Piedmont
Executive Director, Anglican Ghostwriters Guild

[67] Posted by Piedmont on 08-24-2007 at 01:14 PM • top

Please receive the enclosed check.  Henceforth I will ghostwrite all your comments, PM

[68] Posted by Bill C on 08-24-2007 at 01:18 PM • top

GW: Don’t mail your check to the union office.  There is nobody there.  We’re all out of the country working on an important job for Peter Akinola.  Wire the money to me here at my hotel in Abuja.

[69] Posted by Piedmont on 08-24-2007 at 01:23 PM • top

If the IRD can’t pony up and send me my check, then could the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy at least give me one measly chicken dinner?!  These seditious schismatic posts don’t write themselves, you know!!

[70] Posted by st. anonymous on 08-24-2007 at 02:40 PM • top

Sorry St. A but chicken dinners are reserved for Bishops and Greg.
We can give you some mac and cheese though…think hard…it’s really good. Justice for LBGTs or mac and cheese…it’s not that hard a decision when you think about it. If it was box mac and cheese maybe it would be close but we are talking diner grade here.

[71] Posted by Rocks on 08-24-2007 at 02:45 PM • top

Oh i forgot….if you disavow WO you get rice pudding too.

[72] Posted by Rocks on 08-24-2007 at 02:47 PM • top

Greg,

I implore you - Please stop posting anything written by Jake et al.  It seems that any time you post something these guys wrote, I have to read it;  and afterwards my IQ slips by at least a point. 

This has happened each and every time I’ve read things they’ve written.  At this rate, one year from now, I’ll be out of my present job, trying to support my family by making ceramic ashtrays. 

Please, Greg.  For the sake of my wife.  For the sake of my child, for goodness sakes.  Pweese stop. 

Pwity pwese?  Pweettty pwees wif sugr ntop??

[73] Posted by J Eppinga on 08-24-2007 at 04:33 PM • top

Greg, more to the point, can you please get this thread back on rrack.

Jim Naughton’s comment was absolutely clearly racist.
Akinola was right to call him on it in his press release. 
That is the news story, and no other.

Canon Tunde is the official spokesperson for the Church of Nigeria. He again has officially in a press release reiterated what the Global South has maintained for the last ten years: that liberals in ECUSA are racists.  As such, they cannot even be members of ECUSA under ECUSA’s own cannons. Naughton should be deposed for this.

Even if ECUSA did everything demanded of them by Dar and Windsor and Dromantine and all the rest - how can they now repent of their racism? Well luckily we have their own standards by which we can call them to account: they must apologise profusely and unreservedly, resign all leadship positions, and have nothing to do with the church ever again. That is their own standards for contrition for leaders show make such racist statements - and for once, they are Christian and Gospel standards. Such people have no part in Christ, and even when they repent, can have no place in Christian leadership whatsoever.

I find it very sad indeed that the liberals, when not fantisizing about murdering children, forment racism. But the do, over and over again. Personally (exercises in formal theology aside) I support gay ordination and gay blessings.  I am deeply distressed by Akinola
(and Minns) support for homophobic legislation that would consign me for jail for five years simply visiting Nigeria. But that does not and can never excuse racism on the scale Naughton and the other liberals are promoting. They deserve no quarter, no joking, no tolerance for this - and must be extended absolutely none.

And oscewicee, you have absolutely no place telling a Black man, especially a highly estemeed African Christian leader (Akinola, as Tunde’s press release was speaking for him) that he may not tell whites that they are racist. By doing so you are complicit in the racism of Naughton and the rest of ECUSA.

[74] Posted by James Noble on 08-24-2007 at 05:05 PM • top

And oscewicee, you have absolutely no place telling a Black man, especially a highly estemeed African Christian leader (Akinola, as Tunde’s press release was speaking for him) that he may not tell whites that they are racist.

Excuse me, where on earth did I do this????

[75] Posted by oscewicee on 08-24-2007 at 05:18 PM • top

James Noble-
I think our friend Oscewicee was assessing the probable reaction of Jake and Jim Naughton, not expressing a personal opinion.

[76] Posted by tjmcmahon on 08-24-2007 at 05:45 PM • top

Definitely not, tjm. Thanks for clarifying.

[77] Posted by oscewicee on 08-24-2007 at 05:51 PM • top

Initially ignored the publication but for Smuggs and others, there is a press statement copied below

It is very insulting and racist to infer that the Primate of All Nigeria is being dictated to.
      Posted by Tunde on 08-24-2007 at 10:35 AM

I do believe that this was posted by none other than
The Venerable Akin Tunde Popoola
Director of Communications, Church Of Nigeria

To the Venerable Akin Tunde Popoola, we extend our greetings and our thanks for participating in this blog and forthrightly setting out the truth of these events.  We pray for our brothers and sisters in the Church of Nigeria, and thank God for the support of your Church, and the pastoral guidance of Archbishop Akinola.

Please take a moment to read the release either through the link or by scrolling up to the post.  This may be the most important post of the day.  Most of us had an immediate reaction- “Look what TEC (and the Church Times) are up to now.  This is SOOOOO ridiculous.”

I wonder what the official response of the Roman Church would be if someone went out and verbally assaulted a cardinal or archbishop in this manner.  The man these people are insulting and making insinuations about is the leader of the largest province of the Anglican Communion.  We need to recognize that while this particular incident is likely to turn out badly for the spin machine at 815, they are working overtime to do everything they can to discredit Archbishop Akinola and his peers in the Global South

I for one will confess (as would be obvious from my own posts today) that I did not take the “who wrote the letter” story all that seriously.  And in and of itself, it is of no importance.  But what is of importance is the ongoing campaign to belittle orthodox Christians in Africa and Asia, and their leaders.  Our mission is not to laugh at Fr. Jake or his readers, our mission is to support the orthodox Anglican leadership around the world.  And that means not just blogging about how ridiculous these charges are, but to document for others in our parishes and communities that this is part of an ongoing campaign to disparage the best and brightest among us through bigotry and deceit.
TJ

[78] Posted by tjmcmahon on 08-24-2007 at 06:12 PM • top

I am deeply distressed by Akinola (and Minns) support for homophobic legislation that would consign me for jail for five years simply visiting Nigeria.

Can we put this canard to rest, please?  If you are “simply visiting” Nigeria, why would you go to jail?  If you stood on a street corner in Abuja and announced that you were in the country to aid the cause of homosexual marriage and the like, then you might well have a problem.  Stop being inflammatory, please and check the facts.

[79] Posted by GillianC on 08-24-2007 at 07:27 PM • top

I think our friend Oscewicee was assessing the probable reaction of Jake and Jim Naughton, not expressing a personal opinion.

It is not up to me to accept your apology. But based on your comment above, I accept your later interpretation of your earlier statement “I wish that the Venerable AkinTunde Popoola hadn’t said this.”

Our mission is not to laugh at Fr. Jake or his readers, our mission is to support the orthodox Anglican leadership around the world.

As with the previous incident regarating Keaton, those of you still in ECUSA have a responsibility to put your own house in order. As a Western “Christian” on this blog I have some responsibility to call all of us to account. In this case, it requires those in ECUSA to raise a presentment against Naughton for conduct unbecoming, and for the rest of us, raising the matter with his bishop. I did so with respect to Keaton and will do so again with respect to Naughton. 

Regarding the Nigerian legislation, I apologise for partly moving this thread off-topic. To answer GillianC the text of the legislation includes the comments that:

7 (3) Any person who is involved in the registration of gay clubs, societies and organizations, sustenance, procession or meetings, publicity and public show of same sex amorous relationship directly or indirectly in public and in private is guilty of an offence and liable on conviction to a term of 5 years imprisonment.

A clear consequence of this clause is that anyone who is a member or supporter of ECUSA or any other church anywhere which supports gay marriage or who is a member of a human rights organisation which advocates for human rights for gays (nor necessarily marriage - just the right to walk down the street holding hands) can be jailed for five years.
Again I apologise for taking this thread somewhat off topic: I posted those comments originally to make clear that in calling for Naughton’s deposition and removal from the church I was not doing so from a straightforward “conservative” position.  I share the strong concerns raised by the ACI and many others about this legislation - which the Nigeria HOB has unanimously supported.

[80] Posted by James Noble on 08-24-2007 at 10:23 PM • top

I forgot to say but that press release by Canon Popoola was excellent.
Well documented and written, timely, concise and to the point.
Way to hit one out of the park Canon! smile
Wait a minute they probably don’t play baseball in Nigeria….
well whatever is good in cricket then! Great Job!
Now, if only I could post near as well….

[81] Posted by Rocks on 08-24-2007 at 11:09 PM • top

As an aside- always, ALWAYS send PDF’s, not Word docs. Word docs contain metadata that can reveal way more than you want revealed - as Tony Blair discovered:

http://news.zdnet.co.uk/software/0,1000000121,39218713,00.htm

[82] Posted by Joel on 08-25-2007 at 08:02 AM • top

What TJ said here is so important:

what is of importance is the ongoing campaign to belittle orthodox Christians in Africa and Asia, and their leaders.  Our mission is not to laugh at Fr. Jake or his readers, our mission is to support the orthodox Anglican leadership around the world.  And that means not just blogging about how ridiculous these charges are, but to document for others in our parishes and communities that this is part of an ongoing campaign to disparage the best and brightest among us through bigotry and deceit.  TJ
Posted by tjmcmahon on 08-24-2007

I totally agree, except, although it’s not our mission, I do think it is ok for us to have a few chuckles, giggles and guffaws. We laugh at them, but we can laugh at ourselves, too!
It builds commraderie and breaks the tension.
(They’re the ones who say we have to live in the tension they create—like a dysfunctional family forcing the children to witness the repeated enactment of the parents unresoved issues.)

[83] Posted by Deja Vu on 08-25-2007 at 10:14 AM • top

I agree about the importance of tj’s statement above. It almost deserves a thread of its own? Because they are so determined to make small the Global South, where most Anglicans now are, and reduce their voice to insignificance or deny its “authenticity.” The shrillness of productions like yesterday’s “discovery” really disturbs me.

[84] Posted by oscewicee on 08-25-2007 at 10:45 AM • top

I find this whole controversy to be a bit contrived. So what if Archbishop Akinola used someone else’s computer of if he had Bishop Minns assist him with it.

I say this for several reasons. One, my own bishop often consults with senior clergy in the diocese before making major decisions or statements to get their imput, so what? Does that make the Bishop stupid? I hardly think so. In fact it makes him wiser in my estimation as he then understands that the clergy are there to support him. Second, Archbishop Akinola is not an Englishman nor an American. He is Nigerian therefore English is probably his secondary language. So what if someone helped him with grammar, spelling, syntax, ect. Writing in English is much different from speaking it. I simply don’t understand the big deal.

[85] Posted by FrRick on 08-25-2007 at 11:35 AM • top

Contrived indeed, Fr. Rick. Yet they are shouting and hollering about it as if they have discovered the second gunman on the grassy knoll. It is too ridiculous, but it’s meant to make trouble.

[86] Posted by oscewicee on 08-25-2007 at 11:46 AM • top

As I see it, Fr Jake, Susan Russell & co can play this supposed “scandal” one of two ways: either (1) that Akinola’s epistle is for the most part not by him but by Minns, which means Akinola’s an eeviill person who doesn’t write his own stuff; or (2) since Minns wrote most of it, this is proof the GS is being manipulated by eeviill white western males and not Africans at all.  (#2 seems to be their favored tactic right now.)

If they go for #1, then we can always bring up the fact that their idol JFK didn’t write “his” most famous speeches either—and come to think of it, didn’t MLK actually get caught plagiarizing an essay?  I guess they’ll have to dispense forever with MLK Day then!

If it’s #2, then once again, as with the chicken dinner charge, they’re accusing the Africans of being mindless dupes.  Which is, of course, racist.  And having their own favorite charge of racism being used against them must really, really smart.

[87] Posted by st. anonymous on 08-25-2007 at 01:06 PM • top

Deja Vu and Oscewicee-
Thank you for the kind words.  I did not mean to imply that we shouldn’t have some fun with the “tempest in a teapot” aspects of this.  But I did feel after reading Tunde’s post above that it was incumbent upon us first and foremost to show support for Abp. Akinola and the church.  My first reaction had been the same as almost everyone else- which was that you just couldn’t take “charges” like Church Times article seriously. I mean, so what if +Martin Minns worked with the Archbishop to draft the letter. But maybe having 1/2 dozen parody threads spring up in a couple hours was a bit over the top.  Our friend Mr. Noble (pardon me if that should be Fr. Noble- hard to tell the players without a scorecard) may be correct, the proper course may be to investigate whether canons have been violated. 
  In any case, I hope that should members of the Church of Nigeria, or Africans in general, be reading this thread, they will recognize that we indeed take racism and attacks on the Church seriously, that while we have responded to Mr. Naughton and Fr. Jake and the Church Times principally with sarcasm and irony, we hold Abp. Akinola and indeed the entire Church of Nigeria in very high regard.
  It continues to confound me that so many who cast themselves as “liberals” in TEC have such a difficult time accepting that black men can be leaders of the Church.
TJ
Now. to prove I haven’t lost my sense of humor, I think I will go over to Wikipedia and move Jim Naughton’s canonical residence to Pittsburgh.

[88] Posted by tjmcmahon on 08-25-2007 at 01:57 PM • top

To be intellectually honest, shouldn’t these gentlemen take “textual criticism” to its completion by comparing these words with other words that ++Akinola as spoken/written?

If there is symmetry of substance, what does it really matter?

Or are they suggesting that in the same way some say that ‘Matthew has Jesus saying…’, rather than ‘Jesus said…’, for example, that ++Akinola never really said what he said, but +Minns just ‘has ++Akinola saying..?’

[89] Posted by Gone Back to Africa on 08-26-2007 at 12:38 PM • top

I hope that should members of the Church of Nigeria, or Africans in general, be reading this thread, they will recognize that we indeed take racism and attacks on the Church seriously, that while we have responded to Mr. Naughton and Fr. Jake and the Church Times principally with sarcasm and irony, we hold Abp. Akinola and indeed the entire Church of Nigeria in very high regard.

Yes. And having read some of the comments on Fr. Jake’s blog, it’s evident that their racism has a point - an attempt to discredit Abp. Akinola, in whatever way they can. This was a real grasp at straws.

[90] Posted by oscewicee on 08-26-2007 at 01:12 PM • top

Rocks:

A “6” which is comparable to a homerun in baseball, and which means an instant 6 runs for hitting the ball over the boundary (and a ball that rolls or bounces over the boundary would give the batters
‘4’ runs.  That is how a good batter (or a lousy bowler) can reach totals well in excess of 100 runs! 
A bit of trivia!
cool smile

Bill

[91] Posted by Bill C on 08-26-2007 at 01:34 PM • top

Thanks Bill C! smile

Not to beat a dead horse here but has Church Times actually released said file?  Or at least a portion or a screen shot of what it shows?
Not that I think they are lying, I don’t, but is the public just supposed to take their word on this?

[92] Posted by Rocks on 08-27-2007 at 11:21 AM • top

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